3.4mm Masonry Nails V 3mm Masonry Bit!?

[Matthew Bester]

Hi DIYnot,

I am putting down a soleplate for a partition on top of a brick wall. All guides say if it cannot be strapped down to drive in masonry nails instead, that's fine.

However, all the masonry nails I can buy are 3.4mm thick and all the masonry bits are either 3mm or 4mm.

I'm worried if I drive them it 3mm hole they will split the bricks even with a pilot hole.

What gives?

 

[23vc]

I’d be looking at concrete screws/bolts. Whats the actual use case for the “partition”?

 

[Ivor Windybottom]

I think they normally nail into soft blocks, not bricks.

You could use screws.

 

[Matthew Bester]

I’d be looking at concrete screws/bolts. Whats the actual use case for the “partition”?

It is to separate an open loft from my neighbour. He agrees.
The plan is:
Mortar layer on the existing party wall (exposed brick visible joist level)
Treated timber sole plate (nail/screw as post suggests)
Timber foot.
Metal frame (non-load bearing/deflected)
Fire boarded.
Insulated.
Only need 1-hour fire rating but this should achieve 2-hours plus!

I think they normally nail into soft blocks, not bricks.

You could use screws.

I've found some masonry screws, that would be easier!
Nails only needed to be a minimum of 25mm deep into the masonry from what I saw but I can go deeper.

 

[noseall]

It is to separate an open loft from my neighbour. He agrees.
The plan is:
Mortar layer on the existing party wall (exposed brick visible joist level)
Treated timber sole plate (nail/screw as post suggests)
Timber foot.
Metal frame (non-load bearing/deflected)
Fire boarded.
Insulated.
Only need 1-hour fire rating but this should achieve 2-hours plus!

I've found some masonry screws, that would be easier!
Nails only needed to be a minimum of 25mm deep into the masonry from what I saw but I can go deeper.

Use fire foam and some supplementary screws to secure the sole plate. Presumably, the whole wall will gain adventitious stiffness from being fixed to the rafter line, in any case.
You are overthinking the sole plate.

 

[Matthew Bester]

Presumably, the whole wall will gain adventitious stiffness from being fixed to the rafter line.

It goes upto the ridge but only the deflection head is fixed. It allows for roof movement so the wall doesn't accidentally become load bearing but the wall isn't actually attached to the ridge.

6.3.10 Construction of steel framed partitions - NHBC Standards 2024

nhbc-standards.co.uk

It's not a new build but I can't find another standard to go by...

 

[noseall]

It goes upto the ridge but only the deflection head is fixed. It allows for roof movement so the wall doesn't accidentally become load bearing but the wall isn't actually attached to the ridge.
View attachment 365722

6.3.10 Construction of steel framed partitions - NHBC Standards 2024

nhbc-standards.co.uk

It's not a new build but I can't find another standard to go by...

You can still sprag off the underside of the rafters using short lengths of timber (for stability).

 

[Matthew Bester]

You can still sprag off the underside of the rafters using short lengths of timber (for stability).

Something like this?

 

[noseall]

Something like this?View attachment 365726

That would work.

I personally don't see an issue with direct (to the rafter) fixings - via noggins etc.