3 sets of wires? Can i change this to double socket?

[Nikkis9316]

Please bear with me...going to use the 'im a girl card'!!

My old kitchen has been pulled out and left me with an exisiting double socket which looks to have been adapted.

Coming into the box there is (top left) a wire (black, red, green), (bottom left) green wire connected to the metal box, (bottom middle) a wire (black, red and green) and (bottom right) a wire (black, red and green).

The (top left) wire has been taped up and is not in use. The bottom two wires have been connected to further wires (black now becoming blue) and extend to a long piece of wire which i presume was for an electrical appliance (the cooker and hob where in this region).

My question??? Is it possible to return this to a double socket by taking the wires back to their original entry form? My confusion comes from there being 3 sets of wires (one taped and not in use). Can all 3 sets be wired into a socket? (From reading around this i have only come across 2 sets of wires within a circuit).

Any 100% accurate advice most welcome.
Thanks x

 

[mikhailfaradayski]

im sorry, 'girl cards' are only accepted here with photographic evidence any chance??

Failing that, just a boring photo of the wires in the socket might help

 

[chivers67]

Sounds like the top left is / was a spur so you need to find out where this goes and see if it's terminated correctly where ever it is.

One thing you need to buy is some yellow/green sleeving as the green sleeving for the earth wires is now no longer used.

 

[Chri5]

You can't 'blindly' terminate cables.

You know that one of the cables MUST come from a fuse board or down stream socket, the other should be the continuation of a ring and thus also getting power.

But it could be a radial circuit so might simply travel to another socket.

Simple testing will tell. As for the other cable brown, blue, grn/yell that a new colour code from mid 2004+ so you should look or test for a newer socket or fitting.

As for you thinking it may go to a hob or electric cooker point, I do hope not !

The kitchen tends to need a ring circuit at 30/32 A due to washers, microwave, kettle, toaster etc.
A cooker (other than a simple electric feed for gas items) and electric hob require a bigger circuit at 40-45A depending on load.

Add on that your fitting a full new kitchen I would suggest you get a spark in to do the work, with the part P requirement it's really necessary (even if you could do the work).

A halfway house is to see what the spark suggests regarding cables, circuits, switches, fused spurs and you do the route provision and fixing of back boxes, conduits etc

 

[Nikkis9316]

Thanks for the replies (no photo - cheeky!)

Just to clarify for Chri5 - the wires which have been taped up in the socket are what i have found, not done!.
Also there is no new kitchen to be fitted, i have a new kitchen in the extension, this is the wiring left from when i ripped the old kitchen out.

I am converting this room to a study and was hoping to convert this socket back to a plain double socket, but was confused as to why there were 3 sets of wires in it.

I was wondering if i should un tape the wires which have been taped and wire all three sets into the socket? If the taped up wires have been discarded (obviously not correctly) will it matter if they are wired in? Can i leave them taped?

If you men did the job correctly in the first place i wouldn't be left trying to fathom out what was what

 

[flameport]

As the room is being completely changed, this is the ideal time to rip out whatever wiring is in there and install new sockets in the places you actually want them.

As you have found some taped up wires already, there could easily be others, or worse items elsewhere in the room.

 

[Chri5]

Nik, watch it I'll get the sexism police on you

I'd not bother with adding in the taped up socket because you have no idea what it does- it could be a dead cable, buried away, you make it live and when you go to add in a shelf or two- bang, pop and oh dear.

Have you any test equipment, even a volt stick ?

Terminate the 2 x main cables with the fuse removed at the board and test all sockets on the circuit.

To confirm what the circuit controls, go round each socket with a table lamp on a plug. Each socket controlled by that circuit will light the lamp and turn off the lamp when you switch the fuse off.


As for all us men not doing a job correctly- it sounds as if you kitchen contractor as failed, as in they should have tidied up the old kitchen area as part of the works. Leaving a wiring mess (without at least a heads up to you, the client) is poor form.

 

[Nikkis9316]

Thanks Flameport.....would love to rewire and move sockets....but not a financial option, hence being on here!

Chri5, really good advice thanks.......will try all that tomorrow. Definately have one dead socket (the oven and hob, got confused earlier) have put a blank cover over that now.

In all fairness my brother installed the new kitchen and i ripped out the old one, so no one to clear up the wiring except little old me!!

Could have another sexist bash now though....my ex hubby did the original kitchen....so still clearing up his mess 10 years down the line

Hoping to finish this room by friday....so if you never here from me again i've either been electrocuted or had a house fire!!!!

In all seriousness i know my limitations, will cut all power, follow advice and if unsure will leave well alone

 

[Nikkis9316]

I now have a functioning double socket....yippeee!!

Thanks for all your advice (and Mr B&Q man this morning).

Another really girlie question now though.....i have a lamp plugged in the socket at the moment and its working. If i had done something wrong obviously the lamp wouldn't have worked or the fuse box would have tripped straight away wouldn't it?
Dont want any nasty surprises in the night!

 

[Chri5]

Unfortunately without seeing your work it's difficult to comment.

As an absolute basic I would suggest you buy, borrow or steal a Martindale plug tester. It will at least confirm that the socket is wired correctly.

What it won't confirm is the integrity of the existing wiring, which requires a series of tests that require £400+ of test equipment.

Only the copper wire (not the sheath) of each cable should be terminated, without any bare wire exposed. So you should have 2 x L, N, E terminated on the socket. The screws must be tight to grip the cable cores and (with power off) a test 'pull' to make sure they are in firmly should be done.

The back box if metal should be earthed. This can be done via the screw that mounts the faceplate to the back box if the back box only has 1 moving screw lug.

If both lugs slide / move (for adjustment of the socket level) then an earth wire (1.5mm ) should be run between the back box earth terminal and the socket earth terminal- the same one with the 2 x earths from the connected cables.

 

[ban-all-sheds]

Dont want any nasty surprises in the night!

Best not to tell that drooling perve mikhailfaradayski where you live, then....

 

[mikhailfaradayski]

Dont want any nasty surprises in the night!

Best not to tell that drooling perve mikhailfaradayski where you live, then....

No need, ive already tracked her down via her IP/ISP and am posting this from my iphone whilst hiding in the hedges at the bottom of her garden. Just waiting til its dark....

phwh-ha-haaa