All I need to do is move a socket! (w/o getting a shock)

[nv_london]

Hi everybody,

All I need to do is move a wall socket a few feet. However, I’m extremely scared that I’m going to give myself a nasty shock! Underneath my stairs is a fuse box….the fuse box has various levers/switches which are annotated as ‘kitchen’, ‘living room’ etc, when I flick one of these switches, all the sockets stop working in that particular room, however, the main lights are still on in that room and only go off when I flick the main big switch which seems to knock out all power to the house, both lighting and sockets.

So my question is, if I want to move a socket in the kitchen a few feet, can I just flick the ‘kitchen’ switch/fuse and keep the main kitchen lights on and be safe in touching the wiring of that socket? (I know that to really be on the safe side I can flick the main switch, but then it’s so dark, that even by torchlight it’s difficult to see what I’m doing!).

Many thanks for any help.

John

 

[Cartboy52]

Lights and sockets should be on different circuits, so you should be OK to just turn the sockets off. Plug something in to see if the socket is dead (or better still, use a tester).

However, I believe any work on kitchen or bathroom electrics is notifiable to your LABC.

 

[dal5band]

Do both !

I normally plug something in and switch on - like a lamp
then switch the circuit off at the consumer unit and see the lamp go off at the socket.
AND
If opening the socket, test the wires with a tester before touching anything.

 

[ban-all-sheds]

Hi everybody,

All I need to do is move a wall socket a few feet.

1. Have you thought about what you will do if there isn't enough slack in the cables to allow you to do this?
   
2. There are rules on concealed cables which could cause you problems if the cables run vertically and you want to move the socket horizontally, or vice-versa.
   
3. As for this being notifiable - it's not the case that any work in the kitchen is notifiable, but moving a socket is not on the list of work which does not need to be notified....

 

[ban-all-sheds]

I normally plug something in and switch on - like a lamp
then switch the circuit off at the consumer unit and see the lamp go off at the socket.

And then on and off again, to confirm that what you saw was not the lamp coincidentally failing at the precise moment you turned the MCB off

AND
If opening the socket, test the wires with a tester before touching anything.

A proper tester, I hope, not a neon screwdriver...

 

[nv_london]

Thanks for ur replies.

There is enough cable etc to where i want to move the sockets, and I won't be drilling into any other cables, so I'm not worried on that score.

I know that when switch off the 'kitchen' switch that the socket I'm interested in moving is definitely dead. (I've plugged in a toaster/lamp/kettle, and they all work when the switch is on, but not when I switch it off). The only thing that remains on are the main lights.

However, I agree that the best way is to use a tester. Could anybody therefore let me know what I'm supposed to touch with the tester? Should it be the live or neutral terminal in the socket?

Actually, once I've switched off the 'kitchen' switch under the stairs and 'm happy that the socket is dead, I remove the outer casing of the socket to reveal the wires from the cables plugging into the internal part of the socket, do I now take my tester and touch either the live or neutral terminal? Or do I first unplug them? (On second thoughts, I can unplug them, 'cos that's what I'm asking about in the first place), so I must surely just touch either terminal! (Right?!?). But if I do, and it still has power, then what's stopping me getting a shock?!

Thanks and excuse my ignorance on all of this!

John

 

[Welshy]

I don't wish to be negative OP, but from your OP, It doesn't sound like you know enough about leccy and are lacking in the confidence side.

 

[nv_london]

You are absolutely right I'm not confident.

However, I have moved plugs before, but only by switching the main power off to the whole house, which is why, this time, I'd like to do it slightly more scientifically/professionally, and work out what does what.

I.e. if by flicking the 'kitchen' switch, then it's ok to go ahead and move a socket in the kitchen (assuming u've checked that particular socket with a lamp etc).

But also, I was just curious as how to use the tester and why you don't get electricuted when you use it!?

 

[ban-all-sheds]

Because you aren't part of the circuit.

A multimeter has 2 leads - you put one on live and one on neutral, and check that there is no voltage. (Also with the on-again off-again sequence to make absolutely sure that your meter is working correctly).

Of course, if you are clumsy, and touch the metal ends of the multimeter probes, you could get a shock if the circuit is live, but then life is full of ways to get injured or killed through clumsiness....

 

[Welshy]

You are absolutely right I'm not confident.

However, I have moved plugs before, but only by switching the main power off to the whole house, which is why, this time, I'd like to do it slightly more scientifically/professionally, and work out what does what.

I.e. if by flicking the 'kitchen' switch, then it's ok to go ahead and move a socket in the kitchen (assuming u've checked that particular socket with a lamp etc).

As said above, the lights and sockets should be on different circuits. And ideally, but NOT always the case, the upstairs, downstairs and kitchen ring main (Sockets) are on sperate MCBs (downstairs should, Ideally be on RCD).

Anyway, If it is only a normal Socket that you wish to move (not one that is intergrated with the Cooker point), test the socket first, select the "Trip" in the CU for that circuit, switch it off, test the socket is dead again, and take the tester to another Socket outlet (elsewhere in the house that is still on) and prove that it is, indeed still working.

Then, after removing the face plate in the kitchen and before removing the wires, check again to see if the circuit is dead with something like THIS

It is not an approved tester, but they are well worth their money, over and over again.

Be aware that there are regulations, as suggested above regarding all aspects of electric. So be very careful.

Is there enough slack in the cable to allow you to position the socket where you want it?

[/quote]

 

[Welshy]

Morning BAS.

 

[nv_london]

thanks a lot for all your help

(yes there is enough slack)

 

[THRIPSTER]

BAS,


How do check to make sure there isn't a fault on both live and neutral which is causing these both to be live wrt earth? I know what I carry at all times and will use before and after the tester.

 

[RF Lighting]

I know it is a bit late now, but using an appliance to prove for dead is very poor advice.

All it takes is for reversed polarity on the installation (transposed tails for example) and a SP MCB will make the appliance go off and the socket appear dead, while it is infact still live.

 

[emphasis303]

Hi

Hmm, just this weekend I got electrocuted at a friends place due to a shared neutral, I was an idiot for not using a multimeter but apparently even if i did, it wudnt have shown it was live untill i seperated the two neutrals coming into the neutral terminal.

So unless your 100% sure on how the house is wired like i am with my own house, then I wouldnt touch anything without cutting all power