Architrave neon

[regsmyth]

I'm putting in a sliding door and want to make sure we know if the light inside is on or not.

The switch will be just outside the door, but there's not quite enough width space for a normal full sized switch.

Does anyone know if it's possible to buy an architrave light switch with a neon.
I've had a look but no joy yet.

When I took out some redundant wiring, there was a separate "bubble" type neon with two v thin wires coming out the back, which connected to the switch wires etc. Is this sort of set up allowed?

Am I being stupid, do all "neon" type switches have to have a neutral?

 

[bernardgreen]

do all "neon" type switches have to have a neutral?

If the neon is to be lit when the lamp is lit then the neon must be wired between Switched Live and Neutral

If the neon is to be lit when the lamp is not lit ( to help find the switch in the dark ) thentwo options

If the neon is to be lit all the time then the neon is wired between Live and Neutral

If the neon is to be lit only when the lamp is not lit then the neon is wired between Live and Switched Live. But this depends on a lamp being fitted as the lamp filament provides a path to neutral for the very small amount of current for the lit neon.

 

[regsmyth]

Thanks, I haven't quite understood the last option - if connected between the live and sw live, with switch unswitched, enough current can flow to illuminate the neon but not the light. Then when it's switched, won't it still stay illuminated?

Anyhow, I want it lit when the light is on. So I need to take some plasterboard off and replace my bit of 2c+e with a bit of 3c+e. Ooops.

So, can I get a neon architrave switch or will I have to bodge something up?

 

[ban-all-sheds]

Thanks, I haven't quite understood the last option - if connected between the live and sw live, with switch unswitched, enough current can flow to illuminate the neon but not the light. Then when it's switched, won't it still stay illuminated?

No, because the neon is wired in parallel with the switch contacts, so when the switch is on the neon is bypassed.

So, can I get a neon architrave switch or will I have to bodge something up?

One of each of these:

Or one each of these if you want a larger indicator

 

[regsmyth]

Thank you Mr Sheds you're a star.

No, because the neon is wired in parallel with the switch contacts, so when the switch is on the neon is bypassed.

Isn't any current tempted to take the long way round?

 

[aptsys]

The voltage across the switch when the switch is closed will not be anywhere near enough to illuminate the neon. Below about 70V the neon will not strike and hence has a very high resistance. If you replaced the neon with some wire (which is always conductive), some current would flow through the wire, but the voltage across the switch will still be in the order of microvolts.

 

[TicklyT]

Isn't any current tempted to take the long way round?

It's possible, but it's down to the resistance of the switch contacts. When closed, they have a resistance approximately equal to 3/10ths of Nothing, whilst the resistance of the neon is very high.

How do you get to the corner shop just down the road? do you walk there, or do you catch a bus into town, then get a train to London, then Eurostar through the chunnel to Paris, fly from Paris to Hong Kong, Travel overland to Vladivostok, fly to Heathrow then get a Taxi to the corner shop? Again, it's possible, but extremely unlikely (Unless your name is Michael Palin)

If the switch is open, that's like someone has dug a big hole in the pavement outside your front door, so the only way you can possibly get to the corner shop is to wait at the bus stop......

 

[bernardgreen]

There is an alternative route via Mornington Crescent.

 

[Adam_151]

Isn't any current tempted to take the long way round?

No, because the neon isn't an ohmic conductor; as other posters have said it doesn't conduct at all below about 70V*

if were an ohmic conductor (such as a bit of copper wire, or a carbon film resister, etc, etc), then the current would be divided between the two paths in proportion to the reciprocals of their reistances

*effectivly a glass bulb with two electrodes in it, filled with noen gas, for the gas to conduct, you need enough energy to beable to knock electrons out from the atoms of gas (ionise them) and this is a function of voltage
(if anyone can do better, feel free, I lost interest in physics at school...0

 

[regsmyth]

Ok ok I get the bit about the long way round. ish.

Anyhow, I didn't get much further in my quest for the neon architrave switch, as the one BAS suggested is Malaysian and I don't know if they have a distributor in the country willing to deal in single units. Any clues BAS?

So I'm back to considering a standard switch, drilling a hole in the faceplate and connecting one of these:

http://www.maplin.co.uk/Module.aspx...oy=search&MenuName=Miniature Round Panel Neon

Is that allowed? Any better suggestions?

 

[RF Lighting]

You could use a 20A DP grid switch from MK with a neon, and mount it in an architrave grid frame and front plate

 

[333rocky333]

there schneider so most stockists can proberly get them

http://www.pdl.com.sg/products/products.html

http://www.pdl.com.sg/products/1500/p_1500Pillunimated.html

 

[regsmyth]

Getting fed up with this now.
Phoned several wholesalers now about this, still no joy.
I don't think MK do an architrave neon.
The wholesalers aren't really interested in a one-off.
So back to the question - is it legal and allowed to wire up a 240v neon and stick in the wall next to the switch?

 

[ban-all-sheds]

Apologies about the Singapore thing - I just didn't notice - sorry.

But MK do do an architrave grid plate - takes one module, so RF's suggestion is a good'un. You could try drilling a faceplate and fitting one of those neons - it's not illegal, but RF's idea is a lot less faffing about.

In what sort of level of ambient lighting would the indicator need to be visible?

 

[Furkin]

,,,, does it have to be a neon ?
My first thought would have been an LED,,,

but as I'm no expert, i'd ask here first,,,,,

I just thought that a nice neat hole drilled in a basic architrave plate - for an LED - would be a nice option.

(sorry if this is unworkable,,,,,,, just trying to help)