Bedroom floor - boards, my plan

[ChilliBob]

Hey everyone,

I have a room in my new house which is 3.7m by 3.3m which currently has nothing in it. This is going to be our bedroom. The floorboards underneath are, on the whole, in good condition, they look like someone had used them as their floor before the previous occupants added carpet - they had been lightly treated.

Here's my plan, the carpet and underlay have already been removed (because they were grotty and smelly).

Preparing the floor...
1. Remove gripper rods.
2. Remove any staples
3. Use a center punch to hammer down any proud nails
4. Exchange any boards if necessary
5. Fill any holes if necessary... gripper holes I intended to fill with PVA and sawdust. Some knot holes I thought I'd fill with an expoxy and sawdust mix.

Sorting the gaps
1. PVA and then hammer in the slivers into the gaps.
2. When dry use a plane to take off the excess.

Sanding
1. Hire a stand up sander, sand the floor. - The floor isn't too bad so I'm guessing nothing too coarse. Do I get different belts to get a silky finish before I treat?

At this stage I would wear a mask and would tape up the door to minimize dust elsewhere in the house.

Treating
1. Treat with something - I need some advise with this part.

Done!

Is that essentially the steps, have I missed or over simplified anything?

For a first time, how long would someone expect this to take for a room of this size? - Grippers around the perimiter, I guess removing say 20-30 staples perhaps. Filling half a dozen holes, exchanging a couple of boards.

This is the first time I've attempted something like this. Am I correct in thinking this should be within the capabilities of a novice DIYer? - I've removed gripper rods before a few times, handled an orbital sander, lifted floorboards, used a plane, used epoxy. It seems to be the combo of these things...!

Any help, guides, advice very much appreciated.

Thanks.

 

[ChilliBob]

Osmo oil seems to be the daddy to apply when finished, do you guys, concur?

 

[Burnerman]

Your plan sounds firm enough.....lifting boards with minimal damage is an art in itself......the sander hire company will fix you up with sanding belts - you may need a sander that will go up to the edge though. Again the hire people will advise.
Time wise, who knows - it depends on what damage you find, but dont ignore loose boards!
Something to be aware of though....if you start braying nails in, do you know what's beneath - concerning cables and pipes etc?
Finally from me.....these large mobile sanders are a fire risk as they may pick up a spark from a nail (seriously) so do bear this in mind.
Over to the others for a suitable finish!
John

 

[ChilliBob]

I've got a bolster chisel, my Dads usual way of lifting boards, hopefully carefully doing this, in combo with an old chisel too should be okay.

Nail wise, most of them are at most 1-2mm proud if that so that should be fine. In terms of fixing new boards, I read a blog post which suggested using conventional phillips screws (countersunk) rather than the oldskool 'floorboard' nails. What would you say to that John? - It obviously won't look the same but I guess it's better if you need to lift the board again.

 

[bernardgreen]

It is worth it to fit a cheap extractor fan into a sheet of ply wood and fit this over an open window. This reduces the pressure in the room slightly and thus creates draughts through the gaps around the door. This draughts are into the room so little if any dust can get out of the room through these gaps.

It also gets rid of much of the dust through the window making it easier to work in the room.

 

[getitdone]

When you're sanding, go fairly coarse first (say a 40 or 60 grit - the exact number will be determined by the depth of any indentations rather then any surface born matter) then work up to a 100 or even 120 (the higher the grit number the finer the the sanding finish). You don't want to go any finer than that though as most wood floor coatings these days need to make that mechanical key to a slightly open grain and going too fine will close the grain and so prevent that.

In terms of the gap filling, there are certain products on the market that when mixed with the dust (from the later, finer sanding) can be filled in and have the benefit of drying to the same colour as the surrounding wood. Bona make a 'mix and fill', and there are a couple of other manufacturers - Jenkins and Lecol for example - who's products also fulfil the same purpose. Bear in mind that if your boards are the straight edge type and fixed to joists, any filler will dislodge and fall through over time. Use slivers!

In terms of finishing the boards, go for a Hard Waxoil just because you can locally repair any scratches or marks over time (rather than a lacquer where damage means sanding back and starting again. ChilliBob is spot on when he posts above that 'Osmo is the daddy'. In terms of sheer durability, Osmo will outlast all the other manufacturers by a country mile, but it is a slightly trickier product to apply if you haven't done this sort of work before, and has a more limited choice of coloured tints in its range (unless of course you just want to apply a clear, un-pigmented coat). Look online and there are a range of other manufacturers offering a broad selection of tinted Hard Waxoils - Ciranova, Blanchon, Treatex, Fiddes amongst others. They're all relatively easy to apply but Ciranova stands apart as the most durable, and their oak/brown tones don't have that hint of unnatural reddish/yellowness that the others suffer from. Avoid Blanchon's Hard Waxoils even if they do cost a couple of quid less per litre - the surface protection is woeful, even in light domestic spaces: any spills or splashes that aren't quickly wiped off will leave little dark patches over time. Which is fine if you like the leopard's fur look

All that said, finish is only as good as the preparation and application - try on some off-cuts of wood first to get the feel of whatever product you go for.

If you do want to finish with a tint in your floor from any of the pigmented Hard Waxoils, remember that simplicity is key! if a repair ever does become necessary, you'll need to follow the same recipe in the same order with the same products - much easier with just one or two products!

 

[ChilliBob]

Thanks Get it Done, I'm ChilliBob, the original poster, I'd just done some research which suggested Osmo oil, whilst expensive, was the best.

We want as light a finish as possible, so yes, clear. Based on that, would Osmo still be the choice?

Why is it a tricky product to apply? - I'm probably being simple but why is it any different to say varnish?!

 

[getitdone]

Yes, I'd spotted you were the same poster only after I'd hit reply!

When you say 'light', is that as in looking like it does after being sanded, or are you thinking light like a light grey/white tint in the grain?

Hard Waxoils are slightly trickier to apply than varnish (or lacquers as they are now referred to) because an HWO needs to be evened out after being rolled or brushed on. You need to work the excess off, though given you're just doing one room you'd be fine doing this by hand with clean rags (If you're applying clear, un-pigmented coats, then obviously just roll a thin coat on and no need to wipe off - the wiping action is largely necessary with coloured HWO to ensure the pigment has been worked evenly into the grain). As a guide I did my spare room (similar size to yours) by hand and two applications a day apart, each took a little over an hour and a half)
A lacquer is just a matter of rolling each coat on and leaving to dry.

This is why the two product types have two different repair methods - An HWO is a penetrative coating thus much of the stain resisting is done from just inside the top of the wood, and the scratch resisting is being done in conjunction with the surface wood fibre in which the oil has hardened. Whereas a lacquer is more topical (rather like a coat of paint that sits on top - i'm being simple but you can see the principle) hence any scratch to what is in effect a transparent coating needs a complete sand back and start again. There are lacquer repair kits around but they aren't worth the time or money.

There are also hybrid variants of Hard Waxoil, some of which are water based and thus won't yellow the wood. Osmo's Raw or Ciranova's Ecofix (and their Oculto though I haven't tried this one yet) are both very good. Others are Bona's Naturale which is good but to my eye just looks a tiny bit too present, or Blanchon's Original Wood Environment which is ok but again with Blanchon, the protective properties are so poor that you'll probably need to put a rug down on the areas you walk on most to avoid the inevitable scuff and stains.

It is worth noting that the two things that contribute to wood getting that yellow/orange look are UV light (i.e. sunlight) and solvents (a key component in the formulation of HWOs). The former is an inevitable characteristic of wood and happens through exposure over a period of time, while the latter occurs almost as soon as contact with solvents is made. Different species of wood have varying levels of susceptibility to the yellowing - pine for example being particularly prone to going orange (you see it in old pine floors or cladding that were finished in the 70s when coating products had extremely high solvent content leaving the wood looking like it's been tangoed!)

 

[ChilliBob]

Thanks for the reply. By 'light' I mean as close to the freshly sanded (pine) as I can possibly get. So, I guess that's clear.

So this Osmo Oil, do I apply it with a sponge roller like you would gloss, a paint brush, or a rag? I'm a bit confused. Also, it seems there's a ton of Osmo oil choices too.

This one seems like what I'd want?
http://www.osmouk.com/sitechapter.cfm?chapter=82&page=312#PolyxRaw

 

[getitdone]

Yes, that's one of the ones I mentioned and I've had some tremendous results with it in the past. Important thing is always to try it on a board or an off cut first since there can be variation in how these products look on different woods.

Once you're happy, just brush a thin, even coat on. You could use a short hair roller to make the task a bit quicker, but for the small area you're doing I'd stick to a brush - loading the roller will use almost as much as you'll use for your floor! And another coat the following day.

Be aware that the full cure takes around a couple of weeks, but since the cure curve is quite steep initially (in that the first 48hrs it gets 60-80% of the way there) and then it levels off to something like 90-95% at the end of the first week, it is the final week where the final few % cure is reached. Varies slightly for different products and rates of atmospheric conditions etc etc. So while you can walk on it after a couple of days, sock traffic only for those two weeks!

 

[ChilliBob]

I'm hoping to do it just before we depart for a holiday, so it should have two weeks in an empty house.
One concern my mum raised... If you glue in all the slivers, what happens if/when you need to take up the floor boards
I guess she has a point, Pva is stronger than the wood, so a sliver or board would be likely to break. Hmm.

 

[ChilliBob]

If the floor is already varnished and in an 'okay' condition - to the point p40 on an old orbital sander takes it back nicely, would you hire a full on belt sander, or just an edger? - I'm guessing I'll still need a belt sander. I've done some reading about it, frankly the machine scares the cr*p out of me now!

 

[getitdone]

Whatever you do, you need to go back to bare wood in order to ensure a proper key for the new coating. Applying a Hard Waxoil over a lacquer WILL NOT WORK. There are some cross-bonding prep products out there, but they aren't cheap and would defeat the object of your project!

What sander you use is up to you but true that for just one room a good belt sander would be fine (even a 3" one like the Makita 9911). Just takes a little longer! Those large floor sanders can be a bit daunting if you've not used one before...

 

[ChilliBob]

Yeah for sure I know I need to take it back to bear wood but I guess I'm saying it's not a totally knackered floor that looks like mud! - So, it's not like I need to use p16 on a floor sander which could demolish a small village. If anyone remembers I've got that image of Vyvian from the Young Ones when he pimps the hoover and it sucks the floorboards up!!

Most hire places seem to only have the massive ones, hmm

 

[ChilliBob]

I'm still concerned about having all of the slivers glued in place with PVA, it just makes me nervous if the floor needs to be lifted. I'm guessing that gluing them in place is considered mandatory though?