Boiler tactics for ERP 2015

[dmdm272]

Hi, erp 2015 is coming up 26th Sept and the legislation means that if (when?!) my current heat only boiler and water tank set up (an old Thorn) goes pop we will not be able to fit a new gas boiler due to the flue and will be forced to go electric.

We cannot get a gas combi due to the flue.

So my dilemma is do I:

Keep the Thorn until it goes and then get an electric

Tactically replace the thorn wth a new reliable heat only boiler that will hopefully last another 20odd years without problems

Of the electric options one of the benefits would be that we can go "combi" and have hot water/heating on demand and so get rid of the huge hot water tank which takes up a lot of useful storage space....but are electric combis stupidly expensive on bills? How about an electric hot water/storgage heater combo? Is this a better idea?

The flat is a small 1bed and south facing and is heated by surrounding flats so needs little heating even in winter so I'm not sure storage heaters are a good idea as many days the stored heat will not be needed.

Thanks for any advice as it is a confusing dilemma to be in.

 

[plugwash]

Heating using day rate electricity will be substantially more expensive than heating using gas.

A domestic electrity supply is small enough that any instant heat electric system is going to take ages to fill a bath.

 

[Dan Robinson]

The new rules have nothing to do with fluing.

Why do you say that the flue would be impossible?

Is it SE duct or something?

 

[flameport]

Tactically replace the thorn wth a new reliable heat only boiler that will hopefully last another 20odd years without problems

Such a thing does not exist.

Of the electric options one of the benefits would be that we can go "combi" and have hot water/heating on demand and so get rid of the huge hot water tank which takes up a lot of useful storage space....but are electric combis stupidly expensive on bills?

Yes, they cost a fortune to run, and for a 1 bed flat are almost certainly the wrong thing to have.
It's also fairly likely that the electricity supply to your flat isn't suitable for one.

There are 2 main electric options for hot water:
1. Large hot water cylinder heated in advance by electric element, usually overnight as it's cheaper but there is always an option to heat in the day if required.
This gives plenty of hot water and is the only realistic option if you use a bath.

2. Get rid of the bath and fit an electric shower instead, hot water for the basin and kitchen sink can be done with a much smaller water heater (15 litres or so) that will fit under the kitchen sink or similar place.

Provided you get the automatic type, storage heaters only store as much heat as is required, so if the flat is already warm, the heaters will store very little or even nothing.
A 1 bed flat would probably only require 2 heaters, with an electrically heated towel rail or similar in the bathroom.
The main disadvantage of storage heaters is that your flat will be heated all the time - so not ideal if people are out for most of the day.

 

[endecotp]

It sounds like you have an open flue, and have been told that you can't change to a balanced flue, and that no open flue boilers meet the new efficiency requirements. Is that right?

 

[Phill Peck]

Can you explain the issue with flue.

What does this have to do with ERP

 

[vulcancontinental]

All our boilers including ErP can be open flue (powered)

 

[dmdm272]

It sounds like you have an open flue, and have been told that you can't change to a balanced flue, and that no open flue boilers meet the new efficiency requirements. Is that right?

This sounds right but I'm only going on what my gas fitter told me. All I know is that we can't have a gas combi for some reason and that after erp 2015 we will only be able to have electric.

 

[Dan Robinson]

Get a different fitter.

 

[endecotp]

It sounds like you have an open flue, and have been told that you can't change to a balanced flue, and that no open flue boilers meet the new efficiency requirements. Is that right?

This sounds right but I'm only going on what my gas fitter told me. All I know is that we can't have a gas combi for some reason and that after erp 2015 we will only be able to have electric.

I suspect that the experts here will disagree. Maybe if you could post a photo showing your current flue arrangement then the issues will become apparent.

 

[ScottishGasMan]

Assuming the current boiler is fitted to an SE or U duct which means you can not replace with a condensing boiler yes. But so long as you have an outside wall that the flue from a new boiler can be routed out then no reason why it cant be replaced with a nice new condenser.

Literally never came across a property that "cant" have a new boiler fitted. Some alterations and unsightly installs to overcome it but almost always a way around it

 

[endecotp]

You said "1 bed flat" so I guess a shared flue is possible.

Have you seen this document:

http://www.eua.org.uk/sites/default...-efficiency-boilers-and-shared-flue-ducts.pdf

?

 

[endecotp]

And this one:

http://www.corgitechnical.com/cours...es for SE-Duct and U-Duct chimney systems.pdf

 

[vulcancontinental]

There are negotiations I understand going on at the moment for a waiver for SE boilers after the ErP deadline but nothing finalised yet.

 

[dmdm272]

We are a flat in the middle of a development. 3rd floor, surrounded on all sides but one (windows and balcony side). So I guess we are a shared flue of some kind and maybe there are permission issues with the leaseholders about re-routing to external walls for individual flats? Re getting another opinion, is there a particular way to find fitters who are experienced with these large blocks and any possible legal/technical issues? Thanks.