Breach of contract? Gable end tiled not rendered.

[stgoose]

A loft conversion is going awry.

We told the salesman we wanted the gable end rendered. All the quotes we got (from various builders) were for a rendered gable end.

The architects plans (drawn by this company) clearly show a rendered gable end not tiled.

Now - midway through the build the gable end has been tiled and the builders are saying it was costed for tiles not render.

The contract that we signed does not even mention the gable end. It only mentions tiled sides to the actual dormer in a section explicitly titled 'Roof dormer'.

The builders have offered to render over the timber structure but say it wont be covered by the 10 year guarantee because it will crack.

I want to stick to my guns. We've put every penny of our savings into this and to not have what we asked for/expected is awful.

I know next to nothing about the trade and this is really hard.

Any advice greatly appreciated.

 

[limerockconstruction]

I appreciate how you feel....sorry you feel like this, but don't get too wound up about it, as long as the structure is sound and the rest of the work is of sound quality at least be thankful that you haven't been properly stitched up!

Our contracts are usually appended with the Architects drawings which are usually numbered, so if it says it on the drawings then thats what needs to be done, no matter how its been costed.

However, do ask yourself if its worth getting into massive arguments and threats at this stage, not many people ever look at the roof of a property when passing by, all of your friends will only care what the inside looks like. (unless of course its more of a feature than I am assuming!)

 

[dann09]

1. Did the salesman verbally agree that you would get a rendered gable?

2. Does the drawing show and state in the writing detail, that a rendered gable is proposed?
Do you still have the drawing?

3. If you received quotes from various builders then someone ( the salesman or his company, or the architect) issued a schedule of works.
Do you have, or can you obtain, a copy of the S-o-W's?

4. Why did you sign a contract that was not what you proposed?

5. How come you only appeared to notice a tiled gable on its completion?




6. Depending on how much of the contract monies have been paid out, you are still in the driving seat.

 

[noseall]

5. How come you only appeared to notice a tiled gable on its completion?

Ditto?

 

[stgoose]

Thank you for the reply.

We do feel strongly about it; it's such a hugely different look to the property and we'd done so much looking around before committing to the builder and to spending so much money.

I know you hear much more terrible stories than this and I'm very thankful we don't have a true horror story.

But. It's such a fundamental change to the plan. It's not going to look anything like we'd intended. It's their mistake and yet we'll have to live with it and see it everyday.

The architect's plan clearly shows it as rendered yet they don't seem to care what it shows.

 

[stgoose]

1. Did the salesman verbally agree that you would get a rendered gable?
- Yes

2. Does the drawing show and state in the writing detail, that a rendered gable is proposed?
- Shows but does not describe in words.
Do you still have the drawing?
- yes

3. If you received quotes from various builders then someone ( the salesman or his company, or the architect) issued a schedule of works.
Do you have, or can you obtain, a copy of the S-o-W's?
- We have the contract (is that the same?) - it has no mention of the gable end at all.

4. Why did you sign a contract that was not what you proposed?
- the contract didn't mention the gable end. A lesson learnt of course but if it had mentioned it and described it wrongly I'd have noticed.

5. How come you only appeared to notice a tiled gable on its completion?
- I had no idea that the timber frame inside meant that it would be tiled on the outside. My wife rang me while I was at work to say they'd tiled it (it was done in less than a day). I rang the project manager (who I'd previously discussed painting the render while the scaffold was still there) and he told me it was just tiled temporarily as they didn't want to leave it exposed.

 

[stgoose]

Untitled

• stgoose
• 13 May 2013
• 1

This is from the architects drawings. Tiles clearly shown on the dormer cheeks/sloping roof and clearly not shown on the gable end.

The project manager showed us other plans for other jobs where the architect clearly shows tiles on the gable end when tiles are planned.

 

[dann09]

7. I take it that the gable in the posted pic is the gable in question?
No annotation (writing) is visible - gable is a blank?
Where is a rendered gable shown?

8. Do you have a section view of that gable? Please post pics the right way up.

9. Who appointed the project manager?
Who appointed the builders?

10. The Schedule of Works is not the same as the contract. All who quote on a job must receive some kind of S-o-W's in order to proceed.

11. So you had a hipped roof prior to work?

12. At what stage is the interior of the loft - plaster board up, second fix complete?

13. Your contract, perhaps, wouldn't specifically mention the gable, but would refer you to the drawing(s) appended (as above noted).

14. Did you have a rendered gable elevation prior to any loft work?

 

[^woody^]

Here's a tip.

Only sign a building contact that you have read, includes your requirements, and which you agree to.

There is nothing stopping you from adding your own text to a builders standard contract, or crossing stuff out.

Also state that the drawings are part of the contract, and should be built to.

And in this case, if the drawings say render, then infer that the drawings part of the contract.

 

[stgoose]

7. I take it that the gable in the posted pic is the gable in question?
No annotation (writing) is visible - gable is a blank?
Where is a rendered gable shown?

- that is how the architect shows render. It was done after a specific request via email to correctly how the gable end rendered. The same as the existing wall. The is no annotation.

8. Do you have a section view of that gable? Please post pics the right way up.

- I will check.

9. Who appointed the project manager?
Who appointed the builders?

- they are all one company. The architects are separate.

10. The Schedule of Works is not the same as the contract. All who quote on a job must receive some kind of S-o-W's in order to proceed.

- we've never seen this. I'd assume it can't help our cause?

11. So you had a hipped roof prior to work?

- I guess so. It was sloped. We have had a hip to gable extension.

12. At what stage is the interior of the loft - plaster board up, second fix They have just put the plumbing pipes in.

In the wrong place as it happens. The frames for the stud wall are in and the wires for the electrics are in.

13. Your contract, perhaps, wouldn't specifically mention the gable, but would refer you to the drawing(s) appended (as above noted)

- the drawings were referenced for the juliet balcony.

14. Did you have a rendered gable elevation prior to any loft work?

- all walls were rendered.

 

[noseall]

We've put every penny of our savings into this and to not have what we asked for/expected is awful.

Most loft conversions do look awful.
I have yet to see one that actually complements a building.

 

[stgoose]

loft conversions do look awful.
I have yet to see one that actually complements a building.

To an extent agreed. The option we wanted was the better option and looks far better than what we now have.

 

[dann09]

7. The architect is wrong. The conventional symbol for render is a multitude of small dots similar to the concrete symbol.
The order and times of emails is too complicated for here.

9. If they are all one company, then how come various builders quoted for the work?

10. The S-o-W's is essential to your cause, and to any builder starting work on such a job. The S-o-W's, the contract and the drawings all tie in.
I only speak from my experience.

12. The work is well advanced - depending on monies paid, it appears that you are in a weak position for allowing things to reach this stage.
Have a brief, telephone heads up with a solicitor who specialises in construction issues.

13. So something has been referenced - thats in your favour. Its means that the architect is acknowledging that referencing is required.

14. Then one would imagine that, given whats in-place, the builder or architect should have consulted with you about the gable construction and finish.

 

[stgoose]

Developments.

The company has now decided that they will render the gable end. They wont be blocking/bricking it beforehand so the not so good option of rendering on a timber frame will happen BUT they have now agreed to give us the 10 year guarantee as per the rest of the build.

I'm happy enough with this solution and accept that in time we'll almost certainly have to do some repairs - but at least the first 10 years are covered.

Many thanks for your time in responding - particularly dann09.

I hope that I don't have to post here again (at least not with similar size problems/concerns)!

Best of luck to you all.

 

[dann09]

Thank you for letting us know what happened next. Good luck to you, too.