Building regs in new bathroom

[dllive]

Hi all,
Ive got a plumber and builder in to put a bathroom in upstairs. Theyre very professional and have been doing this for years.

What do I need to do in regards to building regs? They say not to bother - they both no what the current regs. They have given me the name and number of the building office at the local council. What do you guys think? Should I get a building officer out before the builders start work? If so, would this cost money?

It should be a straight forward building job (its not a listed property).

Thanks

 

[^woody^]

Building control are only going to be mainly interested in the waste connection and an extractor fan

If you can rely on the builders doing this properly, then you may not want to bother with an application

If you want to apply, you would use a Building Notice, giving 48 hours notification before work starts, and fees will be based on the cost of the work .. with probably a minimum value of £3k for which a fee of about £300 is payable. Fee will be more in line with the value of the woek

 

[dllive]

Hi Woody,
The builders seem pretty hot on building regs (having the door not open out on the stairs, how much space to allow around the sink, bath and toilet etc...). They'll run the extractor fan up in the ceiling, through the loft and out onto the roof. Ill get a fan with a humidity sensor on so the fan runs as long as theres excess moisture to clear. The waste pipe theyre going to run through the floor joists and out the back, connecting it to where the soil stack is situated currently. They said theyll make sure there is enough drop on the waste pipe.
Does that sound OK to you? Can you think of anything else they should consider?
Thanks for your help.

 

[^woody^]

The B/regs are there to protect "the public" from bad builders/building work in the context mainly of H&S

If you are confident that the builders are competent and there will be no H&S issues, then you may want to just go ahead without formal b/regs.

You will always have some come-back for bad work via other means so that is not an issue

The only other potential issue with not getting b/regs would be at sale time. Its debatable whether this type of work will get picked up, however I have never known a well designed and properly done bathroom to cause any problems

Remember the building control do very few checks (you may get just one visit for this work - at the end, unless structural work is involved), and do not monitor the work generally

If new timber partitions are involved, ensure that they are insulated. And the electrical works will need to be done by a competent person.

Also you can, if things don't pan out, always apply for b/regs at any time during the works if things are not as you expected

 

[dllive]

Thanks Woody, thats good to know - you've put my mind at rest.

 

[Richard C]

Thanks Woody, thats good to know - you've put my mind at rest.

I disagree; many will tell you na don’t bovver mate, we will do it all OK & in accordance wiv the regs, trust us it'll be fine . But there is a big risk they will cut corners if they are not being checked by LABC, may completely bodge the installation & it may not function as you want it to.

Constructing a new bathroom or room with a W/C is notifyable work which should comply with several building regulations including plumbing, waste, ventilation, electrics & possible sound insulation of stud walls. More importantly you should consider what you will say when any future purchasers solicitor asks you to supply a B Regs compliance certificate for the bathroom. Lying about notifyable work on the sellers questionnaire is not a particularly good idea either as it leaves you open to civil action if you get found out; it happens.

 

[^woody^]

But there is a big risk they will cut corners if they are not being checked by LABC, may completely bodge the installation & it may not function as you want it to.

That was the point I was making.

The council don't check all the work, and many people think that just because an application is made then they get some assurance that the work wont be bodged.

In reality for this type of work, the BCO may just visit once or twice and he wont check all the pipework or all the studwork or all of any work for that matter. He will check a few token items so that his paperwork is in order. It not the BCO's fault, it is just the way the regime is.

I'd be more inclined to trust competent builders with no B/regs application than I would incompetent ones and rely on a B/regs application and their site checks - it is an absolute false sense of security which many people fall into.

With regards to selling, why would the OP want to lie about the work? Any buyer, and any surveyor can see if a job is done well or not, and whether there is anything of concern.

What can go wrong with a bathroom conversion? If there are problems with leaks they will show very soon. Likewise if there are problems with anything else

And as an example, it is very common for wastes to not run smooth, or to have syphoning purely due to badly laid out or fitted pipework, and this will not be picked up by the BCO, as all he will check is trap heights and the connection to the stack

If there is an element of structural work, then yes the OP may want the councils inspection and approval. But for this type of work the issue is what real value would a b/regs application give?

 

[Richard C]

Many believe that B Regs are a PITA & is some cases they are but the fact is they exist. It’s irrelevant that the job may be done to a good standard & there are no problems, what is relevant is that you have a piece of paper that says that says it’s compliant. Most new bathrooms & revamps will include some sort of work on the electrics of which must be notified & it’s this I’d be most concerned about.

I don’t really understand how anyone doing such work at a professional level would try to convince a customer not to go through BN, I don’t. Alarm bells should sound immediately & they may not have a clue what they are doing or if they do, have something to hide or are intent on taking shortcuts. Building/renovating a bathroom isn’t rocket science & the regulations are not onerous; a submission is not expensive compared to the overall cost of the work & BI inspections are hardly an ordeal. There will usually be two visits but sometimes 3 depending on what you’re doing; in most cases, I’ve found they will at least have a cursory look at the waste runs.

Notifyable work requires a compliance certificate & the buyer’s solicitor’s questioner has specific questions about notifyable building works; if the OP says yes, they will be asked to the certificate, if they cant produce one, it is unauthorised building works & this can cause problems with the sale at the point when you least want them. If the OP can’t produce one & says no, he’s lied on the questionnaire &, if subsequently found out, can lead to a civil claim for damages; it does happen. Many lenders are also getting sniffy about advancing loans on properties with unauthorised building works.

There is also the question of invalidation your house insurance; if the cause of any subsequent claim can be associated with unauthorised building works; the insurance company will most likely reject the claim.

Ultimately it’s the OP’s decision once he’s aware of the facts but I don’t believe advising not to bother with submission is doing him any favours.

 

[Richard C]

Can you think of anything else they should consider?

Just having another look at you post & thought I would add the following;
I suppose not falling down the stairs when you come out of the door is a bonus

There are no B Regs regarding space around the bath & sink.

Does the construction of this room invlove any new stud partitions? They should be sound insulated if adjacent to another habitable room.

How long is the duct on the fan; cheap fans will only do 3m; you also need to be carefull how it’s run or it will end up will pools of condensation inside; Whose doing the electrical work? It must be done by a Part P certified spark who should test any new circuits & provide you a minor works certificate; it’s very important they fit the correct fan for the location with regard to electrical safety zones. Any light must also be suitably IP rated, you cannot fit ordinary lights.

Whey you say waste pipe work through the joists, not literally I hope; there are regulations regarding notching/drilling of joists to ensure they actually do what they are supposed to; like continue to hold the floor up.

How are they connecting the toilet to the stack? How many waste runs are there? These should ideally have separate connections if you want to avoid problems!

Good of them to “make sure there is enough drop on the waste pipe” though.

Whose doing the tiling?