Ceiling down lighters don't work, but bulbs emit low blue light - please help

[Nanny_D]

Hello. I hope you'll go easy on me. I have no electrics knowledge.

I have a loft conversion in the house that isn't used anymore, consisting of two rooms.
A while ago I noticed that the ceiling downlighter bulbs didn't come on at all in the one room, and wasn't instantly bothered as I rarely go in there.
The other loft room has a standard pendant light and that works fine.

The downlighter bulbs are the original old halogen types.

The problem now...
I've now seen that all 4 of the halogen bulbs are (often but not always) very faintly glowing a weak blue coloured light randomly, yet the wall switch is off and hasn't been switched on for a good while, so a little power is going through nevertheless.

Trying switching on the light switch still doesn't make the lights come on at all.

(A new roof was installed a couple of months ago with lots of vibration directly above, so maybe that's jarred something, or as I don't ever use the room, the bulbs may have glowed blue for a good while without me knowing)

Am I best to find out which switch to flip up on the main fuse board to cut the lighting power up there?
I can't get anyone in to look at what's going on for a while, so need to do something myself as a temporary measure.

I'm really worried about an electrical fire risk. Is a fire possible?
I know it's my own fault, but I'm so worried.

Thank you

 

[Wayners]

Halogen is discontinued now.
Swap lights for LED. Don't swap bulbs swap the entire light.

Drop light down and look to see what they are. 12v or 240v.

Test power .

If in doubt get electrician

 

[Murdochcat]

I would politely suggest you find a local competent spark

 

[Nanny_D]

I would politely suggest you find a local competent spark

I'm afraid I can't right now, and not for a couple of weeks. The discovery is terribly bad timing.

I have flipped down the switch on the main fuse board which states 'Upstairs lighting' but it has only turned off lighting on the first floor. The adjacent loft room pendant light still comes on.

There is no way of me knowing how to turn off the power to the top floor, as the stickers under the other flip switches aren't related to that part of the house

 

[bernardgreen]

I've now seen that all 4 of the halogen bulbs are (often but not always) very faintly glowing a weak blue coloured light

If the light is blue then the lamps ( bulbs ) are almost certainly LEDs

LED lamps can glow due to capacitive coupling in the wiring that allows a small amount of current to by pass the switch when it is turned OFF

 

[Nanny_D]

If the light is blue then the lamps ( bulbs ) are almost certainly LEDs

LED lamps can glow due to capacitive coupling in the wiring that allows a small amount of current to by pass the switch when it is turned OFF

Hello.

The bulbs are 20 years old, so I thought they would be the old halogen types.

I've added a photo of how the bulbs shone this morning in darkness.
Only 3 lit up this time out of the 4 and were not as bright as they can often be.

I can check a couple of hours later and they aren't shining at all, then check again a few hours later and they'll be even brighter than before.
Bearing in mind the lights will never come on fully.

 

[ericmark]

If the light is blue then the lamps ( bulbs ) are almost certainly LEDs

LED lamps can glow due to capacitive coupling in the wiring that allows a small amount of current to by pass the switch when it is turned OFF

I would agree, either LED or compact fluorescent, there is no real way halogen could glow blue.

I would think around 2008 the LED bulb started to be used, but early ones were rather low powered. The fluorescent lamp tended to be longer than the standard tungsten I have seen some odd effects with static, but seems unlikely.

LED's have been improving, and I don't think I started using them much before 2016, I got some cheap 1.8 watt units from Lidi for my first, next batch were 3 watt, and it was not until I could get 5 watt versions were they really any good, so around 2018.

The bulbs are 20 years old, so I thought they would be the old halogen types.

That would seem to be the case, if that old. Around 2004 was doing some experiments with red LED's in University, the idea was to over drive them but for a short time and during these experiments we found once damaged the output dropped, and they would not recover, so I would guess the lights got somehow some over voltage which has caused the blue output, I would remove one bulb and see what type, if a 230 volt LED replace one, to see if just caused by bulbs failing, some spike on the supply.

 

[Nanny_D]

I would agree, either LED or compact fluorescent, there is no real way halogen could glow blue.

I would think around 2008 the LED bulb started to be used, but early ones were rather low powered. The fluorescent lamp tended to be longer than the standard tungsten I have seen some odd effects with static, but seems unlikely.

LED's have been improving, and I don't think I started using them much before 2016, I got some cheap 1.8 watt units from Lidi for my first, next batch were 3 watt, and it was not until I could get 5 watt versions were they really any good, so around 2018.

That would seem to be the case, if that old. Around 2004 was doing some experiments with red LED's in University, the idea was to over drive them but for a short time and during these experiments we found once damaged the output dropped, and they would not recover, so I would guess the lights got somehow some over voltage which has caused the blue output, I would remove one bulb and see what type, if a 230 volt LED replace one, to see if just caused by bulbs failing, some spike on the supply.

Thanks. The loft conversion was done 2003, so they are definitely 21 year old bulbs.

I'm afraid to take a bulb out to check, as I can't turn off the power supply.

I watched a YouTube video on removing them, and a guy poked a screwdriver up to get the bulb tilted out of a holding mechanism. I could end up zapping myself poking around couldn't I?

I've got tomorrow only to sort this out as I go away for a while. A fire through faulty wiring is my concern after all the recent disturbance up there

 

[flameport]

I've added a photo of how the bulbs shone this morning in darkness.

It's daylight leaking through from behind.
Just as it's doing at the corner of the window blind.

 

[Murdochcat]

I'm afraid I can't right now, and not for a couple of weeks. The discovery is terribly bad timing.

It may take you that long to find somebody competent to agree to come and take a look

 

[Harry Bloomfield]

Thanks. The loft conversion was done 2003, so they are definitely 21 year old bulbs.

I'm afraid to take a bulb out to check, as I can't turn off the power supply.

If the lights are not on the lighting circuit, then they could perhaps be on the upstair ring main. You could try turning that off, and if that doesn't work, turn the entire house supply off - but, flameport makes a good point above, might it be daylight leaking through? Are they equally bright, after dark?

 

[FrodoOne]

It's daylight leaking through from behind.
Just as it's doing at the corner of the window blind.

Since the "Blue Glow" is coming from the glass "edges"
(and not from the centre where the filament is)
this seems very likely.

Also

The problem now...
I've now seen that all 4 of the halogen bulbs are (often but not always) very faintly glowing a weak blue coloured light randomly, yet the wall switch is off and hasn't been switched on for a good while, so a little power is going through nevertheless.

Trying switching on the light switch still doesn't make the lights come on at all.

"randomly" might actually be associated with "time of day", "cloud cover" etc.

 

[Nanny_D]

Since the "Blue Glow" is coming from the glass "edges"
(and not from the centre where the filament is)
this seems very likely.

Also

"randomly" might actually be associated with "time of day", "cloud cover" etc.

Hello. I'm not sure.
There seemed to be light in the inner bulb part too.

 

[DetlefSchmitz]

To be honest I am wondering how so much daylight could be coming in without being accompanied by rainwater.

 

[Ragnar_AT]

Gable vents or windows perhaps?