cylinder element needs replacing.. can i do this workaround?

[euro]

Gravity fed system. Indirect coil cylinder. GlowWorm Micron 40FF Fanned Flue Boiler. Boiler in kitchen on ground floor, cylinder in cupboard in bathroom on first floor. Bathroom rad has no thermostatic valve so will act as a bypass.. I think?

The element in the hot water cylinder has gone open circuit so i bought a new one but can't get the old one out (worried I will split the tank etc).

I can't get a plumber for at least 2 weeks so i was wondering if I could fit a different central heating timer that has a hot water/hot water & heating switch and wire up to turn off the central heating pump (which is in the cupboard with the cylinder) when Hot water only is selected?? That way I could just leave the old heating element in the cylinder??

If this idea is a no no could I maybe fit a motorised valve somewhere?

I am confident to do either of the above but draw the line at replacing the cylinder myself.

 

[ArtfulBodger]

Do you mean the heating coil has gone, or do you REALLY mean the element?

If the second, then I would seriously think about using another plumber!

 

[euro]

Do you mean the heating coil has gone, or do you REALLY mean the element?

If the second, then I would seriously think about using another plumber!

I do mean the element. I have had a plumber try and remove the element and he didn't want to force it and split the tank. He left me to think about what to do as forcing it could possibly lead to me having to replace the complete tank. He is involved on another job for 2 weeks now.

Before taking the chance of splitting the tank i was wondering if there was another alternative that didn't involve so much expense etc?

I guess my question is really.. How do timers that can select just hot water or water plus heating achieve this? What extra fittings are required to replace an old 'heating only' timer with one that does both?

 

[ArtfulBodger]

I don't want to appear rude, but stop worrying about heating only, new valves, bypasses etc, concentrate on what is wrong.

First of all, wherfe is the element located on your cylinder? is it on the side or at the top? do you have reasonable acceess to it? does the cylinder have a jacket or is it lagged with the expanded foamy stuff? can you see a draincock on the pipework at the bottom of the cylinder?

Cheers

 

[euro]

Its on the top of the cylinder with good access, it has foam lagging which we have cut away around the element area. We have tried heating it and have used a box spanner etc to try and move it.. it aint budging.

There is a drain cock at the bottom of the cylinder yup..

 

[PEDANTICVINDICTIVEMAN]

If you have a Micron ff I dont understand why you cant get hot water only, unless a moron fitted the system !

 

[euro]

If you have a Micron ff I dont understand why you cant get hot water only, unless a moron fitted the system !

I'm sure you can get hot water only but how do i stop the radiators getting hot at the same time if my timer only has an 'on/off' selection and not a 'water/off/water and heating' selection? i know i could put thermostatic valves on the radiators but I am trying to avoid having to go round turning radiators on and off.

How does a timer with a 'water/off/water and heating' selection achieve this.. obviously its turning something electrical on or off dependant on the setting.. but what is it? is it the central heating pump or is there something inside the boiler that is switched??

 

[PEDANTICVINDICTIVEMAN]

I will answer the questions but first I want to know how long ago the boiler was fitted ,was it fitted by a reg installer and has it always been working like that ?

 

[euro]

It was fitted 5 months ago by a corgi registered engineer and I/anyone else has done nothing to it since it was installed. The timer was fitted when I bought the house so it could be 10+ years old or more

 

[ChrisR]

OK a plonker fitted you a crummy system. Whether your hot water would work without the pump depends partly on what diameter the pipes are up to the HW cylinder. Did you have a new boiler fitted to an old system?


But as suggested above I'd concentrate on getting the immersion heater out. I haven't failed to shift one yet - always a first time though. Best tools are A) a box spanner and a 2ft stillson spanner to turn it or
B) a cast iron spanner you can whack with a hammer.

OR you can drill a hole in the brass bit at the top, and go from there with a saw each way until you get to the threads. You'll find you don't damage the threads but it doesn't matter if you do really because the seal is on the top face, which is 7mm or so wide. Have also heard of it being done with one of those craft drills - Dremel or similar, with a bit like a dentist's.

 

[euro]

OK a plonker fitted you a crummy system. Whether your hot water would work without the pump depends partly on what diameter the pipes are up to the HW cylinder. Did you have a new boiler fitted to an old system?


But as suggested above I'd concentrate on getting the immersion heater out. I haven't failed to shift one yet - always a first time though. Best tools are A) a box spanner and a 2ft stillson spanner to turn it or
B) a cast iron spanner you can whack with a hammer.

OR you can drill a hole in the brass bit at the top, and go from there with a saw each way until you get to the threads. You'll find you don't damage the threads but it doesn't matter if you do really because the seal is on the top face, which is 7mm or so wide. Have also heard of it being done with one of those craft drills - Dremel or similar, with a bit like a dentist's.

Thanks for that. I like the idea of drilling into the centre and cutting in. I guess you would cut out a slice of the thread and then squeeze whats left of the element so it breaks away from the cylinder thread?

It was a new boiler fitted to an old system by the way. The pipes to the cylinder are 22mm.

 

[ChrisR]

22mm is too small for gravity circulation to work effectively - unless the cylinder's right above the boiler then it might I suppose.

Cut the head of the thing in halves, roughly, then you can knock the head away from the thread in the cylinder.

 

[euro]

22mm is too small for gravity circulation to work effectively - unless the cylinder's right above the boiler then it might I suppose.

Cut the head of the thing in halves, roughly, then you can knock the head away from the thread in the cylinder.

Thanks... How does the 'hot water/ heating and hot water' work from the timer. is it opening a motorised valve or something

 

[ChrisR]

Dunno mate, we don't know what valves you have! Have a look at the Honeywell domestic site to see what options there are.

 

[euro]

Dunno mate, we don't know what valves you have! Have a look at the Honeywell domestic site to see what options there are.

Thanks I will... sorry about that last question I was asking about how it can be done, not how its done on my system.. me grammer iz terrible

Thanks for the help by the way...