Damp in corner of kitchen

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Hi, When I moved into this house, I knew there was a damp area in the corner of the kitchen, but wallpaper was hiding it. 2 years on and I've stripped all the (easily removed) wallpaper in this corner - I stopped where the wallpaper was well-stuck.

In the pictures you can see the results. The wall in the very bottom corner is sodden - wet through. You can draw an approximate triangle on the walls about a foot above this to form the soaked area. But above this is still damp - as you can see with the wallpaper I stripped. The damp area seems to go as far as the back door.

Now, a bit of thought. In the past the house has had an injected damp course, and as you cans ee the plaster there is fairly new, I think they injected from both sides - the plaster is only new up to about 900mm. The walls are solid 9 inch walls, 100 years old. Along the outside of the house are plastic plugs at floor level. They have been decayed by UV, so must be about 20 years old (And the house had significant works done in the early 90's including new heating and windows so it was probably around this time).

In this corner, on the other side to that socket is a public flagged pavement. The gutter downpipe comes down here and discharges onto the pavement (onto a concrete surface gutter which crosses the pavement into the road gutter). There is a shoe on the downpipe which rests on this gutter. The downpipe and house gutters were renewed a year ago. The outside of the wall doesn't appear damp, but I know its not great having the water discharged onto the ground next to the house. Its been like this (I assume) for 100 years, so I really dont think this would be causing the damp issue.

Coming off the corner of the house here, is a wooden fence. There was always one here, but I renewed it last year. The pointing needs some attention here, but not directly outside the main damp area - the area with poor pointing is a bit higher.

Sometime in the past the house has had a concrete floor laid downstairs. I dont think concrete was standard flooring material in the 1910's for semis and terraces anyway, and there is a wooden former around the base of the gas meter, which indicates that the gas meter was there first! The concrete floor level is at the injected DPC level.

This damp issue is becoming an issue now because I am replacing the kitchen soon and the washer and dryer are going in this corner!

Further along from the socket is a radiator, and I suspect this may be hiding furhter dampness.

Should I employ a damp surveyor (and will home insurance cover this?) or should I take more pro-active action, such as repointing the corner and replacing the concrete pavement gutter with a plastic one with a grill on top and sealed at the house end? (Cant remember the name).

If I were to replace the pavement gutter, am I allowed to do this? Or does the council have to do it (and agree to it)? And would it be chargeable by them?

 
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no picture of the rainwater shoe? It is close to the wet patch? If the downpipe is iron it may be rusted, cracked or leaking at the joints. Have a look on a rainy day.

As this is a kitchen, are there water or drain pipes under the floor?

Where are the radiator pipes?

If you call in a damp-proofing company, you can be confident they will recommend damp-proofing.
 

Theres the pictures of the downpipe and pavement discharge. Downpipe new in 2010 - previous to this, there was no shoe and the water just fell out of the pipe onto the pavement - in this respect it has been improved.

Having just taken those photos, I can now see a few areas of rough mortar (top left of one photo). I reckon if I repoint these bits nicely, this might go some way to curing the damp. But as I said, it seems to be right down in the corner.

There are no pipes under the floor or in the wall in this corner. The water main comes from this pavement, but the stop tap is to the left of the downpipe in the photos - the pipe must go under the fence and then turn into the kitchen. The pipe is lead.

Above the corner is the bathroom, more specifically the toilet. No problems here, no signs of leaking on the kitchen ceiling.

How far back should I take the existing mortar? I dont have access to any power tools such as an angle grinder. I have a hammer and chisel lol.
 
Looks like the main suspect will be defective pointing - but not just adjacent to the internal damp, probably further up too ... moisture may be soaking in and down and then spreading on the DPC

And check the downpipe and gutter outlet for leaks
 
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are those blue engineering bricks at the bottom, or just dirty?

The wet is suspiciously close to the downpipe. Look at it on a rainy day. It might have a leaf blockage or something making it cascade.

Sometimes people put a large slate on the wall behind the shoe.

Is there a good fall on the pavement?
 
I dont know if they are a different brick. The colour change looks gradual though.

There isnt a massive fall on the pavement but i think its sufficient. The road has a massive camber to it as old roads did.

How would the slate be fixed? I will try to observe the pipe on a rainy day but ill get wet as theres no windoze on this side of the house!
 
In brief: if you knock-off the plaster to window sill height and render in S+C+L, and then rake out the exterior to 18-25mm, and re-point, you might give yourself 10 years or so, of damp free walls. However, as has been pointed out, you would have to point extensive areas on both walls, for, as has been indicated, damp may be entering high and manifesting low.

1. your DPC ( FWIW ) injection holes are too high for a suspended or a solid floor.

2. Remove some skirting to see if there is a membrane upstand present. Check the back of the skirting for rot.

3.There are no indications of a leaking RWP on the face brick - what about the gutters, are they splashing over, are they plastic? Does the roofing felt reach into the gutters?

4. Knock-off a little plaster and determine if it is a remedial render or a conventional plaster.

5. Plinth fillets of S+C, renewed bricks and smeared on pointing, indicate previous attempts at remedial work.

6. FWIW That damp shadow in the pics has the classic shape and is in a classic area for condensation? Why not remove all the w/paper and post pics of both walls?

7. While any work is in progress, replace all the lead pipe(s) - contact your utility. That pipe and stop-tap would raise suspicions, esp. given that cement can decay lead.

8. Research on this forum, many experienced and capable views are on offer.
 
it doesn't look like condensation to me.

It looks like there is a leak in that corner, such as a pipe (might be on the other side of the wall) or even that there is a leak under the dpm of the floor, and it is getting past in the corner.

have a look at the concrete floor and see what the damp pattern is.

I agree with tim about the membrane upstand. There should be thick polythene under the poured concrete, folded up above FFL at the edges so you can see it against the wall.

If you have an outside water stopcock, get someone to turn it open and shut while you listen for a faint hissing noise inside, or at the kitchen tap. Someone will describe the glass of water trick.

Consider if there might ever have been a basin, scullery, WC or garden tap anywhere near that wet patch.

Obviously examine the radiator and its pipes for any signs of leakage.

p.s. looking at
the wet seems to me to be centred on the downpipe. Coincidence? I doubt it.
 
Here's the way forward for me:

Point up the rough brickwork outside.
Obtain a dehumidifier and run it for a week or so in the kitchen.
If the dampness persists, investigate further.

After a fair bit of rain, there is very little dampness outside around the downpipe shoe. In fact there is more dampness further up around the poor pointing. So I'm going to try to remedy this first.

Further up the wall the pointing is sound and I'm sure these few dodgy joints are to blame.

A question about pointing - should the bricks be bone dry first? Or can I point up slightly damp bricks?
 
No but as i said, there is very little damp around the shoe - it seems to do a good job of deflecting the water away.
 
You could try using a garden hose and rod it from bottom with water running to check for any blockage or split downpipe, I've seen one where a 2" screw was in the centre of the downpipe bracket to stop the pipe slipping but holding up all the debris instead!
 
Steve, Hi.

One absolute certainty is that your home insurance policy will not cover the costs of repairs.

The two [general exclusions, applicable to all insurance policies are] the insurance policy is not a substitute for general maintenance issues around the home, it is to cover sudden events not gradually occurring problems.

And the second, rising or penetrating damp are excluded, likewise wood rot.

What state is the seal around the window? just a thought?

Ken
 
OK, I took off the fence post that was attached to the wall, and was horrified by the state of the pointing - there was very little between some of the bricks. And there were some wood inserts where previous fences had been fixed, rotting. And bits of metal sticking out of the wall too, old fence nails etc.

Anyway, I raked out the loose mortar, chipped off some of the old pointing, smashed out the nails and chipped out the wood anchors, and re-pointed it all up, putting an angle on the mortar so water runs off.

Down the side of the house (adjacent to the pavement), I also pointed up the missing mortar against the original tar damp course.


I am now 95% sure this pointing was the cause of the damp. It was just soaking up all the water. I know the pointing is not the best quality - I got a lot on the face of the brick, but I'm not too bothered what it looks like as long as it keeps the water out!
 

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