Do I need radiator under triple glazed window?

[FifiGo]

Hi all again,
I'm planning on moving my radiator site to a side wall away from under the room window. Two reasons:

1. Wanting to build a window seat and not wanting to block the heat from the radiator with it.

2. Having a new window fitted above where the old radiator is that's triple glazed so more energy efficient and hopefully less likely to fog up on the inner pane if no heat below through cold weather.

I'm having a larger 3 column radiator as it will be on display much more in new position and it's an old house so will look more the part.

Can anyone see any issues with the plan or should it work without too much aggravation. Thanks in advance .

 

[Wayners]

No problems with your Idea.
Don't know much about triple glazing as not popular.
My only thought is condensation is controlled buy running a dehumidifier for a few hours and not drying washing in house without a dehumidifier doing the work.
If you got high moisture in the air it will go somewhere

 

[Why Not Indeed]

A radiator causes convection air flow which I should think would remove the fog from glass, rather than adding to it.

 

[Notch7]

Having a new window fitted above where the old radiator is that's triple glazed

The temperature of the inner face of a triple glazed unit will be significantly warmer than a double glazed unit…..and that counts hugely in its favour for keeping the glass face above the dew point.

What is the triple glazing spec, ideally you want 4-16-4-16-4 with soft coat low e coating on 2 inner panes.

I have a double glazed garden office and it’s almost never heated…and I get no condensation on the windows ever.

 

[Madrab]

Having a new window fitted above where the old radiator is that's triple glazed so more energy efficient and hopefully less likely to fog up on the inner pane if no heat below through cold weather.

Triple glazing is more efficient as far as losing heat to outside is concerned, without a doubt but a glass window is a still a cooler area compared to the rest of the room. Glass is colder given the fact that it doesn't absorb and radiate heat back as other materials do so a window area always seems colder.

The only reason double or triple glazing fogs up is down to either inferior quality construction that hasn't removed all the moisture out of the air/gas in the space between the panes or the panel's gasket is compromised allowing moisture in. A good quality, properly sealed panel shouldn't fog up regardless of the temp differentials

I'm having a larger 3 column radiator

OK at heating smaller spaces - any medium or large(r) sized room then any designer column rad that has been sized with the same heat output as a traditional convecting rad will struggle to heat the space efficiently and/or quickly.
.

 

[FifiGo]

The temperature of the inner face of a triple glazed unit will be significantly warmer than a double glazed unit…..and that counts hugely in its favour for keeping the glass face above the dew point.

What is the triple glazing spec, ideally you want 4-16-4-16-4 with soft coat low e coating on 2 inner panes.

I have a double glazed garden office and it’s almost never heated…and I get no condensation on the windows ever.

Hi Notch7,
This is the spec for their units and below their glass spec. Does it sound reasonable? I'm completely naive with glazing so just want to make sure I'm not ordering duds.

 

[FifiGo]

Triple glazing is more efficient as far as losing heat to outside is concerned, without a doubt but a glass window is a still a cooler area compared to the rest of the room. Glass is colder given the fact that it doesn't absorb and radiate heat back as other materials do so a window area always seems colder.

The only reason double or triple glazing fogs up is down to either inferior quality construction that hasn't removed all the moisture out of the air/gas in the space between the panes or the panel's gasket is compromised allowing moisture in. A good quality, properly sealed panel shouldn't fog up regardless of the temp differentials

OK at heating smaller spaces - any medium or large(r) sized room then any designer column rad that has been sized with the same heat output as a traditional convecting rad will struggle to heat the space efficiently and/or quickly.
.

Madrab, what's the main issue with the column radiatiors? I'm not looking at the tall designer style ones, but the reproduction cast iron style ones. My rooms aren't massive but taking on board what you're saying, I really don't want to struggle to heat them.

 

[FifiGo]

No problems with your Idea.
Don't know much about triple glazing as not popular.
My only thought is condensation is controlled buy running a dehumidifier for a few hours and not drying washing in house without a dehumidifier doing the work.
If you got high moisture in the air it will go somewhere

I do have a dehumidifier so could employ that if needs be. Just don't want to cause a problem where there wasn't one before.

 

[Madrab]

Madrab, what's the main issue with the column radiatiors

It's really down to the way they heat the space. AS far as radiators are concerned, unless they're fan assisted, convecting rads are the most efficient at heating spaces, they work on the principle of channelling cool air @ the floor, heating it up through the centre past the convection fins then release that upwards and so the cycle continues until the space is heated as required. They work on a basis of 80% convection and 20% radiation.

Next best are your traditionally shaped multi column cast iron type rads, they work on about 40-50% convection and 50-60% radiation depending on how many columns there are. It's one of the reason the old cast rads were so large in the past, it's because they have to work that bit harder to heat the same space as quickly as say convecting rasd would.

The worst are the designer tubular column type rads that work more on a 80% radiation, 20% convection.
It's not that the heat output of the rads aren't comparable, it just about how they go about heating the space and how quickly that happens that makes a huge difference.

 

[Notch7]

Hi Notch7,
This is the spec for their units and below their glass spec. Does it sound reasonable? I'm completely naive with glazing so just want to make sure I'm not ordering duds.
View attachment 356388View attachment 356389

Yes a 40mm triple glazed unit with 14mm air spaces and a quote u value of 0.7 is going to provide you with the full benefits of triple glazing.

The industry doesn’t push triple glazing and it’s not terrible popular because the argument is that it hardly any gain over double. However it has a greater improvement to how a room feels because the temperature on the face of the inner pane is significantly warmer compared to DG. The warmer pane makes the room feel more cosy because you don’t feel the coldness coming from the window.

I have triple glazing in the sidelights of my from door, even on bitter cold days the glass doesn’t feel really cold.

 

[FifiGo]

It's really down to the way they heat the space. AS far as radiators are concerned, unless they're fan assisted, convecting rads are the most efficient at heating spaces, they work on the principle of channelling cool air @ the floor, heating it up through the centre past the convection fins then release that upwards and so the cycle continues until the space is heated as required. They work on a basis of 80% convection and 20% radiation.

Next best are your traditionally shaped multi column cast iron type rads, they work on about 40-50% convection and 50-60% radiation depending on how many columns there are. It's one of the reason the old cast rads were so large in the past, it's because they have to work that bit harder to heat the same space as quickly as say convecting rasd would.

The worst are the designer tubular column type rads that work more on a 80% radiation, 20% convection.
It's not that the heat output of the rads aren't comparable, it just about how they go about heating the space and how quickly that happens that makes a huge difference.

I'm having a rethink. Can't bear being cold and know I'll kick myself if I sacrifice efficiency for style in the depths of winter!
Had a look at the Stelrad type 22 radiators and on the 1600s the BTU is 9457 so that definitely works out a bit oversized for both rooms downstairs.

 

[Madrab]

I'm having a rethink. Can't bear being cold and know I'll kick myself if I sacrifice efficiency for style in the depths of winter!
Had a look at the Stelrad type 22 radiators and on the 1600s the BTU is 9457 so that definitely works out a bit oversized for both rooms downstairs.

Always best to go oversized, you can always turn them down. It would also allow the CH temps to lowered and still obtain the right amount of heat loss balancing output. Which is more in line with the more recent approach to efficiency gains.

Don't get me wrong column rads are lovely but I always advise anyone to go larger or install multiples to ensure they heat their space correctly and as expected. I have noticed recently that the outputs for the same rad types are actually dropping to reflect the real world outputs to suit how they actually work/heat a space. I believe it's to do with the way they test them now and how they actually release their heat into the space they are trying to warm up.