DOWN LIGHTERS

[nessi]

I have 8 hallogen downlighters in my kitchen extension, this is single story with a sloped roof. When the extension was built 3 years ago everything passed with the building inspector and received an electrical certificate.
Above the ceiling is some space age insulation, felt and then roof tiles.
My problem is the terrific draught that comes from the apatures around the bulbs and housing. Bearing in mind I cannot get above the fittings, unless I want to remove all my roof tiles!! so how can I insulate these and protect against fire from the inside.

 

[Sparky2520]

The best i can think of is fire hoods..... they will protect from fire but will do next to nothing for insulation now its all finished..... so to be honest there is nothing you can do to insulate now unless you rip the celing down...... and if it was to be insulated you may have more problems with the fittings overheating then melting the cable etc and blowing lamps.

 

[Steve]

nessi, there is no way to install downlights in a vaulted ceiling without breaching at least one building reg. As you are finding out now - your space age insulation is now worthless, and you are loosing tremendous amounts of heat there, as well as the tremendously inefficient lighting you have chosen.

Fire hoods are not designed for this situation.

The only proper solution is to have a false ceiling containing the downlights, or a standard light fitting, with more efficient lamps in it.

 

[nessi]

Fantastic news NOT.
Thanks for your reply. How on earth do these things get past the building inspector and the trained electrician that passed the electrics I wonder!?

Now what to do???
Thanks again.

 

[1john]

can you make a hatch into the loft space so you can investigate further?

 

[nessi]

If I was a mouse I might be able too.

Thinking of just getting rid of the damn things, hardly ever put them on, too bright and too energy hungry.

How difficult would it be to disconnect the whole lot, without taking the ceiling down do you think. Professionally done of course.

 

[sparkwright]

Should be very easy.

Though the biggest challenge may be getting past the insulation.

A matter of finding the first light, taking the wiring (and possibly extending) to the new centre light position.

Made easy by all the handy 2" holes in the ceiling already provided. ( )

As you have a tiled roof should be plenty of room to fish cables without making more holes.

Take the opportunity to install any extra wiring for sockets, TV, etc, while you have this opportunity.

 

[ban-all-sheds]

How on earth do these things get past the building inspector

Because many of them are shamefully derelict in their duties.

and the trained electrician that passed the electrics I wonder!?

And many of them refuse to accept that their responsibility extends to complying with all of the Building Regulations, not just Part P.


Add those two factors to the blind, ignorant idiocy of many people specifying downlighters (you see them here all the time) who simply will not be told about the problems, and you end up with what you've got.

 

[nessi]

Thank you sparkwright, I think this is what I shall do

Ban all sheds, If i had been told by either my architect, builder, building inspector, electrician or the person that gave me a certificate thats passed the electrics that this was not compliant with the rules and regs I would never have gone ahead with the lighting scheme.
It beggars belief that not one of these people employed by me ever mentioned that this was a non starter.

 

[ban-all-sheds]

Even if it had been OK, reg-wise, you'd still be sat there with lights that didn't work well, burned energy, and gave you terrible draughts.

All of those drawbacks should have been highlighted in the beginning as well.

 

[dingbat]

How on earth do these things get past the building inspector

Because many of them are shamefully derelict in their duties.

and the trained electrician that passed the electrics I wonder!?

And many of them refuse to accept that their responsibility extends to complying with all of the Building Regulations, not just Part P.


Add those two factors to the blind, ignorant idiocy of many people specifying downlighters (you see them here all the time) who simply will not be told about the problems, and you end up with what you've got.

Hear, hear and furthermore, hear!

 

[Vance]

I have 8 hallogen downlighters in my kitchen extension, this is single story with a sloped roof. When the extension was built 3 years ago everything passed with the building inspector and received an electrical certificate.
Above the ceiling is some space age insulation, felt and then roof tiles.
My problem is the terrific draught that comes from the apatures around the bulbs and housing. Bearing in mind I cannot get above the fittings, unless I want to remove all my roof tiles!! so how can I insulate these and protect against fire from the inside.

I had the same problem and have solved it by covering each of the downlighters with a small disc of glass about 10mm wider than the opening for the bulb. I have stuck the glass onto the downlighter using strong double sided tape (D9605) from tape2go.com. The glass I got from instrumentglasses.com, very good quality (no green tinge) and 75p a disc. Could maybe use dots of sealant for fixing the glass - just need something that will allow the glass to be prized off when the bulb needs changed. All bulbs are LEDS so very little heat coming downwards.

 

[bernardgreen]

Very old thread (2010) and fixing bits of glass to hot lamp fittings with sticky tape in a kitchen is pretty stupid. Hot discs of glass falling on people, polished tables or into food is just one hazard.

 

[SaladFingers]

Add those two factors to the blind, ignorant idiocy of many people specifying downlighters (you see them here all the time) who simply will not be told about the problems, and you end up with what you've got.

Indeed.

I'm not a massive lover of downlights, but then I'm not a massive hater.

They have their place in certain areas and applications, but vented roof spaces on single story extensions is defo not a place for them.


Edit: Only just realised this was an old thread.

 

[SimonH2]

I had the same problem and have solved it by covering each of the downlighters with a small disc of glass about 10mm wider than the opening for the bulb.

And how did you determine that this would not cause the fitting to overheat with what should be fairly obvious safety implications ? Quite apart from the impact on lamp and fitting life.