Electrical Safety Test

[Nevets69]

Hi,

I am preparing a house to let out and want to get an electrical safety test done.

The consumer unit looks a few years old and I'm wondering if it will have to be upgraded to a new one to meet current regs.

Thanks in advance.

 

[Taylortwocities]

Get a report done on the installation - its called an EICR = Electrical Installation Condition Report.
This will tell you what is good and bad about the installation. The results will tell you if the consumer unit must (or should) be replaced.

It is impossible to make a judgement from the keboard side of a computer screen!

 

[Nevets69]

So is the EICR the same as the electrical safety test that I'm thinking about for landlords?

 

[EFLImpudence]

There is no such thing officially as an electrical safety test.

Things called that are just a visual check for cracked sockets etc. and you can do that yourself.

 

[Nevets69]

OK so to ensure that the installation is safe I need a EICR report?

And the consumer unit or any other parts of the installation for that matter don't necessarily need to be upgraded to current specs if they are working correctly?

 

[Taylortwocities]

The EICR will test and inspect the installation and will report any items that deviate from TODAY’s Wiring Regulations

Any deviations will be classed depending on the severity of the deviation. Something like a bare live wire would be a C1 which would require immediate sorting out.
If the consumer unit were old, but working, it may not meet today’s regulations. But regulations are not retrospective, so it would be given a C3 which means improvement recommended.
If you Google
What is an EICR
you’ll get some more info on what the process is.

 

[flameport]

The consumer unit looks a few years old and I'm wondering if it will have to be upgraded to a new one to meet current regs.

Very unlikely it will comply with regulations now - but that's very different from it needing to be replaced.

It may need to be replaced - or maybe not, all depends. Post a picture of it here and some info can be given.
For the rest if the installation you will need to have someone inspect and test it.

 

[SimonH2]

Getting an EICR is a good idea - though not legally required, it's in a grey area. There is no specific requirement, but you have a general duty of care to provide a safe property - which is most most easily demonstrated (for the electrics) by having a "clear" EICR. Some agents will insist on it before they'll take on the property.
As a PRS landlord myself, I work on the basis that while I'm happy that the installations are safe - having a piece of paper acts as backside protection as long as it says things are acceptable. If a tenant tries to claim that they were injured by faulty electrics, then you have this bit of paper that shows it was safe before they went in. The alternative is potentially standing in court explaining why YOU (presumably with no relevant qualifications) think it was safe.
Sadly there are some people who look for opportunities to work the system - I've personally had a coupe in who made the place damp and then contacted the council (I think they were angling for a ruling that they shouldn't pay [as much] rent for a hovel) while no other tenant before or since had a damp/mould problem; and they also scammed a neighbour for damaging their van which needed expensive repairs (the damage was impossible to have happened as claimed, and just rubbed off !). Such people know the system and could well use the lack of a clear EICR as a means of trying to extract money from you.

Now, to your specific question ...
Presumably your CU will be flagged as "not to current standards" and category C3 (improvement recommended). This leaves you in that slightly tricky position - are you happy that your backside is covered ? If it's only a matter of it not having a "non combustible box"*, then personally I would not change it just for that. But if (for example) there's a lack of RCD protection then I'd upgrade.

You will most likely have some other items raised. For example, both my properties (mid-late 90s) had pendant lampholders within reach of the bath Both got replaced with more suitable fittings.

So get an EICR and see what comes up. Things like the bathroom lights I mentioned above, just get them sorted - or even pre-empt the check and sort them first. Anything you're not sure about - come back here and ask.


* The regs do NOT specify a steel box. However they do not specify what "non combustible" means and only say that steel is an example of what does meet the requirements. So even though even steel is combustible under some circumstances, it's the only material that can be said to comply with the unspecified requirements - but only because the regs give it as an example of something which does comply. There's bit "a bit of debate" about this, and general consensus is that those who wrote the reg were idiots

 

[ericmark]

Getting an EICR is a good idea - though not legally required, it's in a grey area.

Except Scotland, law does require them in Scotland and there are also rules as to who can do them.

Rest of the country there are no laws about who can do electrical work in domestic premises, there is Part P which is basic an addition to existing laws about have a home safe to live it, and they mean for some work either the person has to be scheme member or they have to get building control to check if the work done is safe, but this only covers some work, this does not include doing an EICR, so in theory you could DIY the report.

It is normally considered some one doing the report should hold a C&G2391 or 2392 and have professional indemnity insurance, and what you are in essence doing as said is moving the blame for anything found wrong at a latter date to some one who has the backing of an insurance company. I have never worked as a sole trader, so never needed personal insurance in case I make a mistake, my son did however, and with his public liability insurance it did cover him to do PIR's as the EICR was then called. And on commercial property they would insist on photostating of document, so even if he stopped trading they could still claim. Since domestic testing lasts 10 years that would be a good idea.

Different with installation work, but where it is the guys professional opinion, not physical work, that bit of paper is both your get out of jail free card, and the ability to get some one else to pay.

Lucky not many people killed due to faulty electrics, and HSE only seem to take an interest in the case of death, Emma Shaw case thank god are rare, however in that case it was not the guy testing who was found guilty, it was the guy who sent him to do the work who was found guilty, for using some one not qualified.

However some times one wonders if courts live in the real world? However I know in Wales I need to either use a letting agent, or I have to register with the county council and take an exam to show I know what I should do. So in Wales I would not do my own EICR nor would I employ anyone to do it, I would use a letting agent and that would be all done by them. If I had 6 homes to rent then I would do course and take exam, but for one hardly worth it.

I considered renting this house, the estate agent called, and gave me a list of things that needed doing first, replace domino hob with one with at least three heat areas, get all three showers working or remove them, remove all the internet connection with central heating, replace front door, replace garage roof as it may have asbestos, etc. And that was before any gas safe or EICR was done. Luck for me, mother died, so it could be sold, there was not need any more to rent it.

I am not saying don't rent, but clearly you don't want to pay for an EICR only to find the letting agent insists on doing it them selves. And for answers on this forum do look at where the person lives, the principalities and countries within GB all have different rules, so do say where you live.

 

[EFLImpudence]

I considered renting this house, the estate agent called, and gave me a list of things that needed doing first, replace domino hob with one with at least three heat areas, get all three showers working or remove them, remove all the internet connection with central heating, replace front door, replace garage roof as it may have asbestos, etc. And that was before any gas safe or EICR was done.

Since when do estate agents have any authority?
Was that not just advice?

I am not saying don't rent, but clearly you don't want to pay for an EICR only to find the letting agent insists on doing it them selves.

Letting agents are supposeed to 'work' for the landlord.

In my experience, in reality they take little responsibility and make no decisions themselves either just asking the landlord what he wants done about this or that or hiring someone else to take the blame so they get a piece of paper with someone else's name on it.

 

[ericmark]

Letting agents have two options, let your house for you, or refuse to take it on their books. Since you can't let it direct without taking course and exam, the letting agent has to take on the responsibility for ensuring you property complies with the requirements.

They can clearly claim that once let, they had told you the land lord some thing needed doing, where some has since it was first let gone wrong, so you should fix it, unless it was dangerous, then either it needs fixing immediately, or alternative accommodation found for the tenants.

I don't know if either the land lord or letting agent can simply say, "sorry, can't get it fixed for two weeks, we will come and collect the keys until fixed." or if they have to find and pay for the alternative accommodation?

This has been a long going question, if you for what ever reason, deem it unsafe to turn power back on, you as the electrician have made the home technically uninhabitable so you have to find alternative accommodation. However it does not say who has to pay for that alternative accommodation, I would assume insurance, this is why land lords insurance is so high, but can't see anything written down as to who pays.

I would guess it would in practice depend on what when wrong and when. And if the tenant has done anything to cause it to go wrong. Central heating failing in my old house could not really be considered as making house uninhabitable, as originally it did not have central heating when built 1980 and the gas fire will heat whole house, but in this house coal fires removed, so central heating failing this time of year would make it uninhabitable. Plus this house same boiler does domestic hot water.

Since I have not done the course, and am not registered as a land lord, I can only guess, maybe some one who has done the course and is registered can answer the questions?

 

[EFLImpudence]

Letting agents have two options, let your house for you, or refuse to take it on their books.

True, but they want the commission for doing very little.
They don't care what happens as they have no direct responsibility.

Since you can't let it direct without taking course and exam,

Absolute nonsense.

the letting agent has to take on the responsibility for ensuring you property complies with the requirements.

They sub that out so that it is someone else's responsibility.

They can clearly claim that once let, they had told you the land lord some thing needed doing, where some has since it was first let gone wrong, so you should fix it, unless it was dangerous, then either it needs fixing immediately, or alternative accommodation found for the tenants.

If they are totally managing the property for a landlord who wants nothing to do with the running of it then, if a tenant reports something they will just send a tradesman to repair it. They do not care how much it costs.

I don't know if either the land lord or letting agent can simply say, "sorry, can't get it fixed for two weeks, we will come and collect the keys until fixed." or if they have to find and pay for the alternative accommodation?

So, now you are saying you don't know.
If it is not physically possible to repair for two weeks then that will be that - the same as in your house - otherwise the repairs will be done.
There are, of course, rogue landlords but that cannot be held to be the norm so no different from discussing rogue anything else.

This has been a long going question, if you for what ever reason, deem it unsafe to turn power back on, you as the electrician have made the home technically uninhabitable so you have to find alternative accommodation.

Electricians do not have that choice.

However it does not say who has to pay for that alternative accommodation, I would assume insurance, this is why land lords insurance is so high, but can't see anything written down as to who pays.

Whatever happens, it won't be the agents who pay and they won't want that to happen as they would lose their commission.

I would guess it would in practice depend on what when wrong and when. And if the tenant has done anything to cause it to go wrong. Central heating failing in my old house could not really be considered as making house uninhabitable, as originally it did not have central heating when built 1980 and the gas fire will heat whole house, but in this house coal fires removed, so central heating failing this time of year would make it uninhabitable. Plus this house same boiler does domestic hot water.

Yes, coal and central heating are the only forms of heating available.

Since I have not done the course, and am not registered as a land lord, I can only guess, maybe some one who has done the course and is registered can answer the questions?

There is no such course and you don't have to be registered except in Council 'designated areas' where bad housing, and landlords are prevelant.
All that is needed to become a landlord is that you have a vacant property.

There are also rogue tenants who make landlords less caring than they used to be but it does not affect the agents.

 

[ericmark]

To my statement "
Since you can't let it direct without taking course and exam," you replied.

Absolute nonsense.

Since 23 November 2015 the Part 1 of the Housing (Wales) Act 2014 there is a legal requirement for landlords to register, and must provide accurate and up-to-date information about themselves and their rental properties in Wales.

Since I don't live in England I don't know what happens other side of boarder. It costs £33.50 if done on line, however since we have not rented out the property I did not look further into the requirements.

I assume the registration includes a test as you fine things like this site to help you answer the questions, seems you need 70% correct. Some of the questions seem to have nothing to do with the welfare of tenants, telling when property subject to a mortgage the mortgage provider, or knowing the loft insulation will affect an Energy Performance Certificate, will not really help the tenant.

However it seems you need a licence to rent property and you have to be trained.

 

[EFLImpudence]

Since 23 November 2015 the Part 1 of the Housing (Wales) Act 2014 there is a legal requirement for landlords to register, and must provide accurate and up-to-date information about themselves and their rental properties in Wales.

Then you should have made that clear. The OP did not state he was in Wales.
I can find no reference to a course nor exam; merely registration.

For people in England my response was valid.

 

[StephenOak]

Then you should have made that clear.

In his first comment (number 9), paragraph 6 Eric said "However I know in Wales I need to either use a letting agent, or I have to register with the county council and take an exam to show I know what I should do. So in Wales I would not do my own EICR nor would I employ anyone to do it, I would use a letting agent and that would be all done by them. If I had 6 homes to rent then I would do course and take exam, but for one hardly worth it" (emphasis added).

So I think he did make it clear that this from a Wales-based POV.

For people in England my response was valid.

Holding you to the same standard you set for Eric. Where exactly did you make it clear that your comments only applied to England?