Electrics in new flat

[gjscott75]

Hoping someone can help... amongst several other problems I'm having in my flat (which was built only a year ago) is that I've gone through 11 lightbulbs since I moved in 6 months ago; they blow when the lights are turned on. Obviously not every time a light is switched on, but they've never blown after the light's been on for a while, it's always within a fraction of a second of turning them on. It's not isolated to any one room, and it's happened with various types of bulbs (regular pendant bulbs, candle type bulbs in wall lights and also spotlights which, I think, have some sort of transformer attached to them).

My knowledge of electrics stretches to replacing a bulb, frankly, and the builder had been blaming it on the supply coming into the property. I had the supplier come out (Scottish Power) to check that the power coming in was within tolerance. It wasn't, it was running anywhere between 245 and 259v, so they adjusted whatever it was that needed adjusting, and it's now within tolerance. I've since bought a UPS for my computer and it shows that it's now running between 240 and 250v.

The blowing lightbulb saga continued though, and it's not the only symptom. Even with nothing else switched on in the flat (well, apart from the fridge/freezer and boiler, I suppose) the lights can sometimes dim for a tiny fraction of a second. Blink and you'd miss it, you'd barely notice it if you weren't really paying attention. It seems to happen randomly and is apparently unrelated to anything else... although when I switch the vacuum cleaner on, it can almost be made to happen on command. None of this happened in my old flat, although the difference was it was in a building that was over 100 years old and the electrics, whilst not quite as old as that, certainly had a fair few years under their belt.

I went back to the builder again and his final word on the matter was to give me a copy of the electrical compliance certificate for the flat. Except, it wasn't for my flat, it was for the flat downstairs because he couldn't find the one for my flat.

Just last week, coincidentally, I happened to be painting a wall in one of the rooms and unscrewed the light switch from the wall so as not to get paint on it. This is what I found...

I've said it before, my knowledge of electrics is shockingly (ahem) bad but, I wouldn't have expected to find 3 sets of live, neutral and earth going into a single light switch (which controls a single bulb). Or for 3 brown wires to be going into the switch. Or for a choc block thing in there. This is, after all, a brand new building.

Is this normal? If not, and this standard of work is common throughout the flat, could this be the cause of many a dead lightbulb and randomly dimming lights?

Any advice, comments or suggestions gratefully received.

Thanks,
Graeme

 

[baldelectrician]

The lights are normally wired this way (all connections are acessible) and when JO public changes a light there is only 1 cable at the ceiling light.

The switch connections are OK (maybe a bit untidy with bare copper showing where the cables enter)

The issues may be one of 2 things
1. Supply - you can ask Scottish Power to put a data recorder on at your meter.
2. Cheap lamps. You should replace all your lamps with branded lamps (osram, philips, sylvania). If you use cheapo supermarket lamps they last a lot less time and don't stop the surge tripping the MCB.

Change the lamps, and see how it goes before calling Scottish Power.

The voltage should be 230 +10% -6%
(216V-253V)

 

[daytona]

not surprised you got probs with electrics.that second fixing is extremely shoddy.

you have copper showing on one of your permanent lives,
when you push the plate back it may touch on the un sleeved part
of the earths,you could also trap a neutral with the screw when you screw the switch back.


tbh,you need to get them back mate,thats awful

 

[gjscott75]

The issues may be one of 2 things
1. Supply - you can ask Scottish Power to put a data recorder on at your meter.
2. Cheap lamps. You should replace all your lamps with branded lamps (osram, philips, sylvania). If you use cheapo supermarket lamps they last a lot less time and don't stop the surge tripping the MCB.

Change the lamps, and see how it goes before calling Scottish Power.

The voltage should be 230 +10% -6%
(216V-253V)

It was only after Scottish Power put the recorder in the flat that they found the readings were too high (up to 259v, apparently). That's been tweaked down and, according to my UPS, it's not been above 250v since, so I'm going on the assumption that it's within acceptable tolerance levels but, unfortunately, bulbs continue to blow. I've also been replacing the bulbs that have blown (well, the pendant ones anyway) with Osram branded bulbs but they too have also eventually blown?!? There's 5 flats in the building and I'm the only one with this problem. It's hardly conclusive, but I'd guess the builder would've put the same bulbs in all the flats (or, at least, I can't see why they'd go to the trouble of sourcing different bulbs for my flat compared to the others) so it seems like it's something unique to this flat.

Given that the builder refuses to actually address the problem, it's looking a lot like I'm going to have to deal with it myself, but even if I do get an electrician in (as it's not something I'd be comfortable with myself), I've no idea what to even tell them, other than the problems I've described.

 

[thompsk]

Have you tried energy saving lamps instead of normal tungsten filament lamps ?

 

[gjscott75]

Have you tried energy saving lamps instead of normal tungsten filament lamps ?

Yep, I have a few lamps that have energy saving bulbs, and they've all been fine. It's only the 'fixed' lighting (ceiling and walls lights) that've blown?!?

 

[baldelectrician]

If the fixed lighting ceiling lights are spots (GU10) these can cause issues.

The GU10 lamps don't have transformers and are known for having a short life. (you can tell a GU10 lamp, as the bit that goes into the holder is chunky, as opposed to 2 small pins)

It wouldn't do much harm to get an electrican in to do a basic (not a full PIR) check, and get him in to test the voltage. His volt meter should be calibrated.

I two meters capable of checking voltage, both calibrated.

 

[breaker1]

Have you spoken to any neigbours to see if they are having problems, its always a good indicator to whether the problem is in the installation or on the network, dipping lighting is normally a supply voltage problem

 

[plugwash]

Hoping someone can help... amongst several other problems I'm having in my flat (which was built only a year ago) is that I've gone through 11 lightbulbs since I moved in 6 months ago; they blow when the lights are turned on. Obviously not every time a light is switched on, but they've never blown after the light's been on for a while, it's always within a fraction of a second of turning them on. It's not isolated to any one room, and it's happened with various types of bulbs (regular pendant bulbs, candle type bulbs in wall lights and also spotlights which, I think, have some sort of transformer attached to them).

My knowledge of electrics stretches to replacing a bulb, frankly, and the builder had been blaming it on the supply coming into the property. I had the supplier come out (Scottish Power) to check that the power coming in was within tolerance. It wasn't, it was running anywhere between 245 and 259v, so they adjusted whatever it was that needed adjusting, and it's now within tolerance. I've since bought a UPS for my computer and it shows that it's now running between 240 and 250v.

The blowing lightbulb saga continued though, and it's not the only symptom. Even with nothing else switched on in the flat (well, apart from the fridge/freezer and boiler, I suppose) the lights can sometimes dim for a tiny fraction of a second. Blink and you'd miss it, you'd barely notice it if you weren't really paying attention. It seems to happen randomly and is apparently unrelated to anything else... although when I switch the vacuum cleaner on, it can almost be made to happen on command. None of this happened in my old flat, although the difference was it was in a building that was over 100 years old and the electrics, whilst not quite as old as that, certainly had a fair few years under their belt.

I went back to the builder again and his final word on the matter was to give me a copy of the electrical compliance certificate for the flat. Except, it wasn't for my flat, it was for the flat downstairs because he couldn't find the one for my flat.

Just last week, coincidentally, I happened to be painting a wall in one of the rooms and unscrewed the light switch from the wall so as not to get paint on it. This is what I found...

I've said it before, my knowledge of electrics is shockingly (ahem) bad but, I wouldn't have expected to find 3 sets of live, neutral and earth going into a single light switch (which controls a single bulb). Or for 3 brown wires to be going into the switch. Or for a choc block thing in there.

nothing wrong with this wiring arrangement, there are two main wiring arrangements one of which ends up with three cables at the light and one at the switch and the other ends up with three cables at the switch and one at the light. The latter is becoming more common because fancy imported fittings are not very friendly to having multiple cables.

On the other whoever actually did the wiring has not done it to a very high standard, the tails of wire are rather on the long side and there is bare copper visible.

Bad connections would be my prime suspect, I would have a go at every connection on the lighting circuit making sure it is neatly made and tight.

 

[gjscott75]

Have you spoken to any neigbours to see if they are having problems, its always a good indicator to whether the problem is in the installation or on the network, dipping lighting is normally a supply voltage problem

Yeah, spoke to them and they've had nothing like the problems I've had (one neighbour has had two bulbs go in the space of 8 months, the other neighbours have had no problems at all apparently, whereas I've had 11 go in the space of 6 months).

Doesn't sound like there's a quick fix and it really needs properly checked out by an electrician. I guess my UPS might not be correctly calibrated and the supply could still be too high, perhaps?!?

Anyway, thanks to everyone for their advice and suggestions, it's been very helpful.