Fire Door Building Regs

[AndyBill]

Hi wonder if anyone can help?

2 storey, 3 bed 1930 semi converted to 4 bed with loft conversion in 1989,
there is a fire door on the loft conversion but original 3 beds are not fire doors,
I applied for a 'retrospective' completion cert for loft conversion as this was never signed off in 1989.
Bldg Control inspector said conversion was fine but i now need to put door closers on the original 3 bedroom doors!

Any advice would be very welcome.

cheers

 

[noseall]

i would advise fitting closers on the other three doors.

i am not a fan of automatic closers because they maim small children.

just tell the inspector that you can be trusted to close the doors yourself.

 

[AndyBill]

but what is the point in putting closers on doors that aren't fire doors?
i thought closers were to keep fire doors closed?

 

[chappers]

Fire door building regs for loft conversions are a joke.
they can't make up their minds.
The first loft conversion I had anything to do with required closers on original doors to bedrooms I think this is where you are.
This then changed to closers on original doors to every habitable room off of the escape route out of the house.
This then changed to fire doors with closers to every habitable room.
Now it is currently fire doors, no closers necessary, to every habitable room or room containing a boiler and here in Oxford original doors can be kept without closers if you provide a mains fed interlinked smoke alarm to every habitable room and any room containing a boiler.

 

[AndyBill]

Also there is an alternative means of escape from the loft , another velux window had to be fitted lower down,

would this make any difference to having fire doors/closers?

 

[chappers]

No that makes no difference and is no longer a requirement remember you are complying with building regs from 1989.
i would just do what they want, it could be worse you could have to be complying with modern building regs, then you would be ripping down all your walls to upgrade insulation etc.
i would use overhead closers that fit to the doors and frames and then remove them once you get the job signed off.
if you use chain closers you will have far more damage to repair if you choose to remove them

 

[mikric]

Only current requirement for closers in a single dwelling as you have described ,is on an internal door to a garage .Perhaps your bco has read on the site notes or plan check that these were a condition of your conversion.
But seems a bit daft to me

 

[chappers]

I believe the rule is it will have to comply with regs at the time i.e closers on doors.
its either that or replace all doors with fire doors to comply with current regs. I know which i would rather do.

 

[AndyBill]

i spoke to the BCO this morning and basically its put door closers on the non fire doors or get fire doors fitted!

i queried door closers on non-fire doors and the response was this would give some degree of protection.

(not wedged open they dont!)

otherwise fire doors could be fitted without closers and leaving these open would offer no degree of protection!


i just dont understand these building regs!!

anyway thanks for all your comments

 

[^woody^]

Fire doors will include self closing devices - otherwise they are not fire door installations

If you ever see the difference that a closed door (any closed door) makes in a domestic fire then you will know how a self closing device even on a normal door can help

 

[freddiemercurystwin]

i just dont understand these building regs!!

As mentioned already it needs to comply with the regs at the time. When all’s said and done, closers fitted or not, removed if desired, its you and yours who are at risk if you leave doors open or not and that risk should be placed on your shoulders and no one else’s.

 

[noseall]

some folks can be trusted to close all doors before bedtime.

 

[PaulAdman]

we should also follow other way which can safe us from fire.

 

[chappers]

In dee it is pretty straight forward we should all take responsibility for our own actions, the inclusion of closers just leads to people wedging doors open, close all doors at bedtime and you are as well protected as if you have closers.
As has been said even a non-fire door gives massive protection compared to a wedged open door.
As I said above just put closers on get it signed off then it's up to you whether you remove them or not.

 

[jeds]

When you apply for regularisation of unauthorised works you must comply with the regulation applicable to when the works were completed - not the current regulations. i.e. in your case 1989.

What you've been offered by the BCO complies with neither so it's a compromise offer: standard doors with closers or current reg fire doors without closers. (closers are no longer required on domestic fire doors except on entry doors to flats)

Personally I would go for the latter.