Flat roof, EPDM vs Felt

[Twils]

Hey all

In the middle of the current storm i have not one but two leaking points on the flat roof. I had a quick look in the storm to see if any tiles had fallen onto the flat roof, but cant see any.

I wasn't able to properly get on the roof however due to the wind so it could have been damaged by debris in the storm.

Its torch on felt, and about 11 years old, so i am going to get the whole roof replaced, someone is coming tomorrow to do emergency repairs (they cant today as the wind gusts are 75mph)

I am a considering rubber this time around, but i am worried about its susceptibility to damage from debris or foot traffic and extreme heat with the summers we have nowadays in the UK

Ideally i would have fibreglass, but dont think my budget extends to replacing all the boards

I am just curious how you feel torch on felt compares to EPDM?

I was originally going to replace the roof in the spring due to its age, but ideally would like more than 11 years out of the next roof

Thanks.

 

[freddiemercurystwin]

11 years is rubbish for a felt roof, must have been done poorly.

 

[robinbanks]

Curious to me that you consider fibreglass superior to EPDM..

Fit the rubber then have a layer of stones to shade/provide some falling debris protection?

Pics would help

 

[noseall]

Hey all

In the middle of the current storm i have not one but two leaking points on the flat roof. I had a quick look in the storm to see if any tiles had fallen onto the flat roof, but cant see any.

I wasn't able to properly get on the roof however due to the wind so it could have been damaged by debris in the storm.

Its torch on felt, and about 11 years old, so i am going to get the whole roof replaced, someone is coming tomorrow to do emergency repairs (they cant today as the wind gusts are 75mph)

I am a considering rubber this time around, but i am worried about its susceptibility to damage from debris or foot traffic and extreme heat with the summers we have nowadays in the UK

Ideally i would have fibreglass, but dont think my budget extends to replacing all the boards

I am just curious how you feel torch on felt compares to EPDM?

I was originally going to replace the roof in the spring due to its age, but ideally would like more than 11 years out of the next roof

Thanks.

Three ply felt with mineral cap sheet, every day for me. But then again, I have access to a brilliant flat roofer.
As said 11 years means a poor installation.

 

[Twils]

Thanks for the responses all

It is interesting to hear people say 11 years is a sign of a poor installation since the company we used are one of the best regarded in the area, i had hoped it would at least last until spring but at the end of the day it is leaking so i guess i will get it all replaced. If anyone can recommend a good roofer in the west mids i would be really grateful!.

Its a bit of a coincidence that is leaking during a massive storm and there are a LOT of trees here, so it is possible there is debris damage?

As for GRP vs Rubber, i just had it in my mind that rubber is vulnerable to tearing and that it expands/contracts with temp change which might cause issues

Its why i went for 3 layer felt last time

Budget is an issue, its come at the worst possible time (i have just paid out for a completely new bathroom) so funds are quite tight. I am not sure how much difference the cost between rubber and felt is though, i guess i will see what tomorrows roofer says

Thanks again

 

[noseall]

Its a bit of a coincidence that is leaking during a massive storm and there are a LOT of trees here, so it is possible there is debris damage?

There could be a number of aggravating factors, with the wind being one of them. Assess once the storm has passed.

 

[Twils]

Cheers, yes i will and will see what the roofer says.

I no longer trust my instincts in finding a reliable tradesman unfortunately.

Two years ago i had new soffit, fascia and gutters- i wont bore people with the details, but despite amazing reviews on checkatrade etc the roofer did a number on me.

 

[noseall]

Two years ago i had new soffit, fascia and gutters- i wont bore people with the details, but despite amazing reviews on checkatrade etc the roofer did a number on me.

We have a name for those checkatrade chancers - twunts (or similar).

 

[Twils]

Unless you have good traders from word of mouth, how do you spot the con-artists?
We have a reliable electrician, plasterer, tiler and plumber now (and use only them) but the ...roofing twunt had fab reviews.

He also assured us the quote was an 'all in price' when quoting, then added 1k to the price half way through the job (he said the felt and support trays needed replacing)

He had 3 courses of tiles off at this point and heavy rain was forecast so it was very hard to argue with him, however when he had finished i asked for his bank details and was told 'that was a cash price, its £500 more for bank transfer' (cash had never been mentioned)

At that point i did push back, as despite being extremely mild mannered i was really angry and insisted on bank transfer and a written receipt for the agreed price or nothing.

apologies for the boring rant btw

 

[robinbanks]

he said the felt and support trays needed replacing

Who quotes for roof redo and assumes that they can reuse the felt and the trays? Heck, trays are such a recent invention that I'd expect most roofs that needed redoing to not even have them.

that was a cash price, its £500 more for bank transfer' (cash had never been mentioned)

"it won't make any difference whether it's bank transfer or cash mate; I'm doing this place to sell and I have to inform HMRC of who, what and how much I've spent on the roof anyway, to lower my capital gains bill"

Unless you have good traders from word of mouth, how do you spot the con-artists?

If I have to fly blind into a multi tens of thousands pounds deal with someone, no recommendations, I ask em if they'd be happy me coming to watch them work on one of their other jobs they're on with right now.
No trade worth his salt, knowing his stuff and having pride in his work has ever said no

(And there have been a few I've decided not to hire post seeing how they treat other people's properties)

Alternatively, see if they agree to being paid daily at the start, you buy the materials so they're yours and any time you're not happy they're paid up and off the job - no great shakes

 

[omph]

I installed a one piece EPDM roof on my garage roof (40m2) 7.5 years ago, still looks brand new and looks like a mirror when it rains which is very pleasing to look at. The expansion/contraction is a natural issue with all materials and not something particular to epdm. If its a serious issue, you can get a white colour membrane to mitigate it.

The rubber itself should last a long time, most issues arise when joining two membranes or doing corner work - and thats usually because lap sealant isn't used to seal the EPDM rubber to the seam flashings.

Lap Edge Sealant | Rubber Roofing System

Lap Edge Sealant is ideal for sealing spliced edges of cured EPDM & uncured EPDM Elastoform Flashing. Buy online from Rubber Roofing Direct now.

www.rubberroofingdirect.co.uk

 

[Twils]

That is good to know, thanks- last time i looked - EPDM is about twice the price of EPDM?
I guess getting quotes is key, but i will just pay for the temporary fix and call out tomoz and i am worried about the damage to the wood.

 

[omph]

That is good to know, thanks- last time i looked - EPDM is about twice the price of EPDM?
I guess getting quotes is key, but i will just pay for the temporary fix and call out tomoz and i am worried about the damage to the wood.

Its more niche so it is more pricey. Your best bet is to educate yourself about the various systems, how they are done properly and then run it against the roofer to gauge his knowledge and whether he is corner cutting. Or you can pretend you know your stuff and specify what you want done.

You may need to replace the roofing boards too if you already have felt. The residue on the wood will prevent proper sealing - OSB boards give the strongest stick and smooth boards like ply are usually less optimal. If you do have OSB and they are in good condition, just tell the roofer to flip the boards.

 

[Twils]

Just an update

Roofer came out today, he said absolutely no need to replace the felt, he said it looks in good condition, seams are good etc, he said a small part of the flashing has been damaged, he has done something temporary but is coming back to replace the flashing

He didnt charge me today as he 'got the chance to quote' and was only up there 20 mins. (i cant get my head around that!) and is going to quote for replacing flashing completely.

 

[Twils]

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