Front garden socket

[ldoodle]

Hiya,

Got some MK Masterseals in the back garden for various stuff, and we're in the process of gutting the front and starting again (i'm talking breaking up concrete slab-come-path-come-patio!).

Anyway, as we're turfing half of it (non walkway areas) I thought about putting another masterseal for the mower.

Now my question isn't how to do it, more should I/am I allowed to do it. I keep thinking about waking up one morning to find Tom, Dick and Harry have plugged an extension lead into it and they're using hoovers to clean their cars!

I was planning to come out the back of an internal socket, through the wall (at a downward angle), take one of the 2.5mm cables into the masterseal and run a new short length of 2.5mm from the masterseal into the internal socket, to extend the ring. Or I could put a spur (internally) that controls the external socket but then that means having to turn the outside socket on from the inside!!! It also means having to chisel out the wall for the backbox as me and surface mount don't get along very well....

Unfortunately the 2 'house' walls I can mount them on are easily visible from the road so it would be obvious. Only other thing I can think of is to come out of the wall with SWA and bury it under the turf and mount the socket on the inside of the fence where it's hidden.

 

[MalcofArabia]

Will you need to extend the leg of the ring that comes through the wall into the masterseal? how do you intend to do that?

I'm assuming that the downstairs ring is RCD protected if your installation is not 17th edition. The existing masterseals are they also of this ring, and if they are how have you wired them?

Also you could fit the socket in something like this

http://chinafeiyuegroup.en.made-in-.../China-Waterproof-Steel-Enclosures-IP65-.html

If your coming through the wall with twin +E you need to make sure you protect the cable. I would drill a 20mm^ hole and hammer some 20mm^ PVC conduit through the hole, it does fit snugly and then seal with silicone at both ends, no need to go right through the hole with the silicone, as you then could get a problem with cable factors.

You know of course that this is notifiable as it is classed as a special location in the garden so you will need to either tell your local building control or get an electrician who is part of a competent person schemes.

 

[JohnD]

you can put a switched FCU on the inside wall before the cable goes through to the outside socket. That way you can turn it off when you are not using it.

it is much better fixed to the wall than bury a cabl;e under the garden. You are not allowed to fix to a temporary structure like a fence anyeay, as it may blow away or fall down.

 

[ldoodle]

Will you need to extend the leg of the ring that comes through the wall into the masterseal? how do you intend to do that?

The T&E coming 'into and out of' the internal socket have enough slack on them (suspended timber floor) to pull up through the conduit buried in the wall and poke through to the outside. So one would of them would be pushed through, then another back in from the Masterseal into the internal socket, completing the ring.

I'm assuming that the downstairs ring is RCD protected if your installation is not 17th edition.

All socket rings are RCD protected.

The existing masterseals are they also of this ring, and if they are how have you wired them?

Yes I have an Upstairs/Loft ring and Downstairs/Garden ring. The back garden Masterseals are on the same ring as the other downstairs sockets.

They have been wired into the ring; internal socket to Masterseal 1, Masterseal 1 to Masterseal 2 with buried SWA, Masterseal 2 to Masterseal 3 with buried SWA, then through an air brick back inside, into an SWA capable junction box, then out of this junction box with T&E into the next socket inside.

Also you could fit the socket in something like this

http://chinafeiyuegroup.en.made-in-.../China-Waterproof-Steel-Enclosures-IP65-.html

Will have a look as those later.

You know of course that this is notifiable as it is classed as a special location in the garden so you will need to either tell your local building control or get an electrician who is part of a competent person schemes.

Yes. I want to decide if I want to put one there first (hence the post), and it's 50/50 at the moment!

 

[ldoodle]

you can put a switched FCU on the inside wall before the cable goes through to the outside socket. That way you can turn it off when you are not using it.

Yeah I did think that but would like to avoid the agro involved if I can!

it is much better fixed to the wall than bury a cabl;e under the garden. You are not allowed to fix to a temporary structure like a fence anyeay, as it may blow away or fall down.

Of course, should have thought of that!

What about a floor box buried in the turf, with turf patch on top (instead of the traditional carpet) to properly hide it?

 

[ChrisRogers]

solution? http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/MK-Masterseal...045?pt=UK_DIY_Material_Electrical_Fittings_MJ

 

[ban-all-sheds]

you can put a switched FCU on the inside wall before the cable goes through to the outside socket. That way you can turn it off when you are not using it.

Yeah I did think that but would like to avoid the agro involved if I can!

What aggro?

 

[Chri5]

you can put a switched FCU on the inside wall before the cable goes through to the outside socket. That way you can turn it off when you are not using it.

Yeah I did think that but would like to avoid the agro involved if I can!

What aggro?

The OP can't be 4rsed tp sink a single back box adjacent to the socket he intends to spur off.

So although John D's solution is the best and covers the aspect of 3rd party user abuse (due to the socket being controlled by the f/spur switch) is too much aggro

 

[DetlefSchmitz]

solution? http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/MK-Masterseal...K_DIY_Material_Electrical_Fittings_MJ[/QUOTE]

Only if the key switch disconnects both poles!

 

[ldoodle]

you can put a switched FCU on the inside wall before the cable goes through to the outside socket. That way you can turn it off when you are not using it.

Yeah I did think that but would like to avoid the agro involved if I can!

What aggro?

I do love your short, sharp, to the point questions BAS

The aggro of having to sink a back box into the wall, but I suppose if I did do that I would take out the double back box that the internal socket uses and replace it with one of these http://www.tlc-direct.co.uk/Products/AP540.html

Can anyone confirm if the Masterseal keyed solution disconnects both poles?

Thanks

 

[ldoodle]

Can anyone confirm if the keyed solution is legit!?!

Looking at the Masterseal tech specs PDF, there is no mention of the keyed version.

http://www.mkelectric.co.uk/Documen...pecifications/T25 MASTERSEAL Tech 628-640.pdf

 

[ban-all-sheds]

Can anyone confirm if the keyed solution is legit!?!

Looking at the Masterseal tech specs PDF, there is no mention of the keyed version.

http://www.mkelectric.co.uk/Documen...tions/T25 MASTERSEAL Tech 628-640.pdf[/QUOTE]
http://www.mkelectric.co.uk/en-GB/P...ted/masterseal/Socketoutlets/Pages/56487.aspx

Only if the key switch disconnects both poles!

Why would it not be a solution if it was just a SP switch?

It is, BTW, as the above link shows, but I'm curious as to why you think it would be no use if it was SP...

 

[DetlefSchmitz]

I assumed the whole point was to stop vandals causing problems with the house supply. Without giving people ideas and spelling it out - can you think of a way to trip someone's 17th edition circuit, given access to only the neutral and earth?

 

[ban-all-sheds]

OK - I thought the concern was theft, not vandalism.

But I doubt that your average vandal is clever or resourceful enough to try and create a NE fault.

 

[Monkeh]

*quickly hides his N/E fault plug*