Hive Wiring Question for Worcester Greenstar 24i Junior Combi (with pic)

[andre1990]

I'm hoping someone can confirm the wiring before I go ahead and (hopefully not) cause some damage.

I'm wiring just a Hive Heating system, the water is on-demand and not set via timer.

I'm planning to do the following:

Questions I have:

1) Does that look right? Will I have two wires screwed into the L and N terminals of the Hive plate as they come in from mains and go back out to the boiler?

2) Do I need to have a jumper between Live and Common (L and 1 on the plate)? I've seen some tutorials on Youtube saying that it is needed so that the boiler can switch the live to the 'heating on' output on the boiler

3) My boiler has a jumper between Ls and Lr, do I remove that?

Thanks in advanced.

 

[stem]

1) Does that look right? Will I have two wires screwed into the L and N terminals of the Hive plate as they come in from mains and go back out to the boiler?

The Hive should get its 230v supply N & L from the same 3A fused supply as the boiler. This is usually a fused connection unit not a plug.

2) Do I need to have a jumper between Live and Common (L and 1 on the plate)? I've seen some tutorials on Youtube saying that it is needed so that the boiler can switch the live to the 'heating on' output on the boiler

No, you don't need a link.

3) My boiler has a jumper between Ls and Lr, do I remove that?

Yes the link is there because there isn't presently any room thermostat fitted.

 

[andre1990]

Hi Stem,

Thanks for the reply. My boiler appears to be plugged into a 3 pin socket in the wall. It has a fuse inside the plug.

But to clarify, with power coming in from the fused supply, does the diagram still stand - as in, the supply of L and N comes from the fused supply, into the hive plate, and then from those same two terminals on the hive plate, then goes back out to the L and N on the boiler?

 

[stem]

Hive N connects to the Boiler N
Hive L connects to the Boiler L

Remove the link between Ls and Lr

Hive 1 'Common' connects to Boiler Ls (Live supply)
Hive 3 'Heating' on connects to Boiler Lr (Live return)

To access the wiring terminals on some combi's requires removal of a room sealed compartment, if yours is like that it's not a DIY job and should only be done by a RGI (Gas Safe) who can carry out the necessary safety checks to make sure the compartment is properly sealed up again afterwards.

 

[andre1990]

Thanks Stem. And N and L from fused supply into hive also?

FUSED SUPPLY N + L ---GO INTO---> HIVE N & L Terminals ---> FROM HIVE N & L ---GO INTO---> into BOILER L & N

(Im comfortable with the 1 + 3 connections, just concerned I've not understood the flow above here correctly).

 

[Deleted member 267285]

To access the wiring terminals on some combi's requires removal of a room sealed compartment, if yours is like that it's not a DIY job and should only be done by a RGI (Gas Safe) who can carry out the necessary safety checks to make sure the compartment is properly sealed up again afterwards.

Stem is correct, this boiler has a rubber seal which makes with the cover, therefore requiring safety checks afterwards. (Gas safety installation and use regulations 26,9).

 

[stem]

Thanks Chris_W. I can never remember.

 

[ericmark]

Yes completely crazy way of doing things where the electrical inspector has to remove a gas seal to inspect and then a gas person has to replace it. We did leave the boiler alone, considering it as an appliance, and we were only checking the installation not appliances connected to it, however building regulations consider anything fixed as part of the installation, be it bathroom fan or boiler, so electrician has to inspect the connections to boiler when doing an EICR.

Of course for gas seal looking at round cable, and to be rated at 90°C not thermal plastic, would need to be thermal setting, it states 3A fuse nothing about if plugged in or with a FCU. The diagram is good.

If you can't read the diagram one must ask should you be doing the job? I seem to remember in old house with a Bosch there was a seal around front cover, but below was open? So not so sure if gas seal or vibration damping? To test a seal there must be a test point, I have looked on the manual and can't find any test points for the case, out of interest can you show me where it is tested and to what pressure, it seems likely there are boilers with sealed cases, but nothing I can find on the instructions for this one. Clearly if an electrical inspector needs to call a gas safe person to test after he has inspected there should be a clear notice to tell him.

 

[andre1990]

No seal.

Thanks Stem. And N and L from fused supply into hive also?

FUSED SUPPLY N + L ---GO INTO---> HIVE N & L Terminals ---> FROM HIVE N & L ---GO INTO---> into BOILER L & N

(Im comfortable with the 1 + 3 connections, just concerned I've not understood the flow above here correctly).

For anyone wondering, the answer to this question was yes.

All done and working fine as per diagram in post #1 which is also the same wiring as used here

 

[ericmark]

Thanks, it did seem daft to have a seal an electrical inspector would need to disturb it when doing an EICR.

 

[Deleted member 267285]

To test a seal there must be a test point, I have looked on the manual and can't find any test points for the case, out of interest can you show me where it is tested and to what pressure, it seems likely there are boilers with sealed cases, but nothing I can find on the instructions for this one. Clearly if an electrical inspector needs to call a gas safe person to test after he has inspected there should be a clear notice to tell him.

You don’t test the case seal, it’s work on a gas appliance, so covered under gas safety installation and use regulations 1998 regulation 26, paragraph 9. This is also from the gas safe website, refer to can I remove the cover from a boiler.

 

[Gasguru]

And just to add that I've come across several Greenstar Junior cases that have been incorrectly fitted.
On these models the outer casing forms a sealed chamber.
Modern boilers are a significant step backwards in terms of safety, a seal failure can result in combustion gasses leaking into the room if the casing is compromised.
Lack of servicing on the Juniors frequently results in the top burner seal burning through creating a hazard.
It is particularly easy for those not careful to cross-thread the lower screws...repair involves drilling out several rivets, if the boiler is close to a side wall it requires removal from the wall at considerable expense.

 

[notsochilled]

Hi, thank you to all the contributors of this post, especially the op. It’s answered a lot questions for me. I do, however, have a follow-up query to this.

I have WB 38CDI that need to connect my hive to. At present, it is being powered from a fused socket.

My question is, if I disconnect this cable from the boiler and connect the L N E wires to the Hive controller and then take a 5 core cable from the Hive controller to the L N Ns Lr and Ls terminals on the boiler, will that work? Will the boiler have the power supply it needs?

Or will I continue to need this 3 core separate power cable to supply the boiler?

 

[stem]

Both the boiler and the Hive (single channel version) require a permanent 230V supply from the same 3A fused connection. So the boiler N and L remains as it is.

The Hive requires a connection to the same 230V N and L supply as the boiler, then also:
Hive 1 'Common' connects to Boiler Ls (Live supply)
Hive 3 'Heating' on connects to Boiler Lr (Live return)

However I refer you to the above post made by Chris_W.

this boiler has a rubber seal which makes with the cover, therefore requiring safety checks afterwards. (Gas safety installation and use regulations 26,9).

This is not a DIY project and should only be done by an RGI [Gas Safe] who can make the necessary safety checks afterwards.