Home Purchase - work quoted and rewire?

[logictom]

Hi all!
I am looking to purchase a home and have just had a electrical test completed on the house. It has come back with a few items to be fixed, I was just wondering if anyone could give it a read over and see if the quote is in the right ball park:
No earth bonding to gas/water and main earth undersized
New fuse box with RCD protection
Bathroom fan wired on 30A circuit, to be rewired on 6A circuit
Spot lights in bathroom not IP rated
Number of metal switches not earthed - mentioned the back box was so just a case of connecting to switch
Few pendants replacing and a new cupboard light.
He is sending out a formal quote but reckoned £700-800, can't recall if that inc VAT. Does that sound reasonable?

Also...
The house was built in the late 70's, hasn't had a rewire carried out and wiring is ok as is. Now I know this is a 'how long is a piece of string' question but how likely it would require a rewire in the foreseeable future (<10yrs)?
What is it that warrants a rewire? Degradation of the wire insulation? I'm just wondering what sort of values these circuit impedances and insulation resistances 'should' be.

Thanks for any assistance

 

[RF Lighting]

Obviously it's hard to say without seeing the job, but it doesn't strike me as being outrageously expensive or worryingly cheap.

Things that normally envoke a rewire are lack of CPCs (earths) to lighting circuits, which from your repart I appears you have.

Lack of sockets / switches / lights etc, it's often quicker to rewire than try and extend / modify old circuits

Failing insulation values, which could be caused by old insulation perishing, or mechanical damage to cables, ingress of damp / moisture to fittings / accessories.

Botched installation / bad DIY modifications etc

It sounds like your report has been fairly thorough, and has highlighted any immediate issues. If your house is wired with PVC cables and there is an earth to every point and the installation was done to a reasonable standard, then probably nothing to worry about for a good few years yet.

When your electrician replaces your fusebox, he should caarry out a full test of the installation and provide you with a certificate to prove he has left it in a safe condition.

 

[ban-all-sheds]

You should get more quotes anyway.

Ask him (and the others) what testing they will do before putting in a new CU, and on what basis they will do any work needed to fix anything which goes wrong when they do.

Re "new fuse box with RCD protection" - did the electrician advise this, or say you had to have it done?

 

[logictom]

Thanks for the responses.
Nice to see it's in the right ball park but as advised I will get a couple more quotes before going ahead.

Good to hear it won't necessarily need a rewire in the near future, I've attached a pic of the report if anyone is interested or spots anything that I may not understand.

The report states "No RCD protection throughout (new fuse box required)" and is marked as C2 - Potentially dangerous urgent remedial action required.

Untitled

• logictom
• 19 Jul 2012
• 1

Untitled

• logictom
• 19 Jul 2012
• 1

 

[RF Lighting]

It really winds me up these people that don't know what an EICR is for or how to fill it out.

You are testing and inspecting the installation and reporting on it's condition. That is it.

The IECR is not the place to recommend what improvements are required.

A statement such as 'new light required in kitchen cupboard' is just pointless. WTF?? Tell me why a new light is required, and which regulation(s) the existing light is contravening.

It seems the OPs electrician has done a pretty poor job over all of properly filling out his certificate.

No unique certificate number. Test results not identified as to what type of certificate they relate to. No customer name, address or post code.

Distribution board designation 'as marked' What the hell??

No reference methods, no numbers of points served, no kA values, no max permitted Zs values, a 6.0mm² with a 4.0mm² CPC, and apparently there are some 6A BS3036s in the OPs installation!!
No page numbers at the bottom

No. of phases, No. of wires, Rating of main fuse, Main earth verification, 8 boxes for main switch details all left empty.
On to the observations section, it asks you if any further investigation is required for each departure. 'YES or NO' not ermm I'm not sure so I'll leave it blank.

3 boxes under the observations also not filled in.

These should have ALL been completed.

I only hope this certificate gets picked out by the crappit inspector

[/rant]

 

[Adam_151]

The IECR is not the place to recommend what improvements are required.

[/rant]

I don't see why you can't. Obviously this cannot be in the place of describing the fault found as the OPs sparky has done on the last point. If nothing else it gives the estimating guy a bit of a clue how to price the remedial works.

For example, from one of my recent ones I've got something very much along the lines of "Upstairs warehouse emergency lighting self contained Non maintained bulkhead fittings have been connected into outgoing side of lighting DB switchfuse in switchroom along with submain. Requirements for overload and fault currrent protection not met, also does not comply with BS5266. Fittings require rewiring onto local lighting circuits, this is a steel conduit installation and therefore this will involve pulling additional conductors into existing conduits. Approx 8-10 fittings."

 

[VFRsarethebest]

I have just signed up on the site as i am interested in getting a new consumer unit fitted,plus a kitchen to be completely wired when i replace it.I take on board all of the advice i have seen in various posts, about using a qualified Electrician to do the job,testing certificates,etc.But what i cant understand is the variation of opinion between professionals as to how the work should be carried out.Particularly with regard to the kitchen wiring.Not just on this forum but others i have seen as well.Dosen't give me a great deal of confidence,particularly as i could do all the work myself to the correct standard,it's just that i can't give myself a certificate of compliance.I am sorry if this sounds a bit blunt but it is me and my Wife who are going to foot the bill for this work.So i want it done to the best standard.And i thought it was just a straightforward job.

 

[JohnW2]

Ask him (and the others) what testing they will do before putting in a new CU ...

It would seem that he has already done a fairly thorough EICR (even if not documented perfectly). That being the case, would you really expect him to undertake further testing if he were to replace the CU in the fairly near future?

Kind Regards, John.

 

[sparkybird]

Those NAPIT forms are pants, eh?

I can't see a requirement to test N-CPC for insulation resistance, so there is a danger that a fault of this nature won't be picked up and once the RCD board is fitted, it'll be tripping away....

 

[RMS]

It really winds me up these people that don't know what an EICR is for or how to fill it out.

Unfortunately it's quite common.

You are testing and inspecting the installation and reporting on it's condition. That is it.

Hence the term Condition Report.

No reference methods, no numbers of points served, no kA values, no max permitted Zs values, a 6.0mm² with a 4.0mm² CPC, and apparently there are some 6A BS3036s in the OPs installation!!
No page numbers at the bottom

Incorrect disconnection times too.

Any unused boxes look better with n/a in them. Then you defiantly won't miss any out.

 

[Adam_151]

I can't see a requirement to test N-CPC for insulation resistance, so there is a danger that a fault of this nature won't be picked up and once the RCD board is fitted, it'll be tripping away....

It would get picked up on the Live/Earth one SB... Phase and neutral connected together, tested to earth. It doesn't say Phase/CPC

 

[sparkybird]

Hi Adam

Ah but would it? If I squint at the forms then I think it says 'LIVE/CPC - which would suggest as you are saying (test both Line and Neutral to CPC) but how many would just test the LIVE (ie not the N?). Obv not you but....

NICEIC forms ask you to record them both separately, which can be helpful when fault finding.....

PS Didn't the term phase go out with the last regs???

 

[JohnW2]

Ah but would it? If I squint at the forms then I think it says 'LIVE/CPC - which would suggest as you are saying (test both Line and Neutral to CPC) but how many would just test the LIVE (ie not the N?). Obv not you but....

You're probably right about some people - but those are the ones who don't realise that 'live' means N as well as L - and I, personally, would question whether they should be doing EICRs if they don't understand that!

Kind Regards, John.

 

[sparkybird]

yes John and pigs might fly....

I've got a local spark round here doesn't issue an EICR if the installation is unsatisfactory - this is what he tells his customers - and of course it makes it much harder for others (ie me!) to quote for the remedial work if there's no paperwork!

 

[JohnW2]

yes John and pigs might fly.... I've got a local spark round here doesn't issue an EICR if the installation is unsatisfactory - this is what he tells his customers - and of course it makes it much harder for others (ie me!) to quote for the remedial work if there's no paperwork!

I'm not really sure I understand that, nor how it relates to the point I was making. If an electrician is contracted to undertake an 'EICR', the 'R' of which means 'Report', then surely part of that contract, even if only verbal, requires the provision of the report - unless, of course, the electrician decides that he does not want to be paid for the work done! It sounds as if such people definitely should not be undertaking EICRs, if they are viewing them as some sort of 'certification' of an installation, rather than the EICRs which they are!

How do you think that people would react if someone they commissioned to undertake a structural survey on a property declined to issue a report because they had identified structural problems?!

Kind Regards, John.