Is Party Wall act applicable in these circumstances?

Joined
9 Apr 2014
Messages
29
Reaction score
1
Location
London
Country
United Kingdom
I own a 1st and 2nd floor maisonette. The ground floor shared freeholder is accepting of my plans. The neighbours to the right (No.5) are accepting of my plans. The neighbours to the left (No.1) are NOT accepting of my plans.

My plans are:

1. To replace the timber structural wall on 1st floor with an RSJ. The RSJ would connect into party walls either side.

2. To replace the timber structural wall on 2st floor with an RSJ. The RSJ would connect into party walls either side and the angle will be changed.

3. To remove chimney breasts on side of No.5.

4. To convert the roof from valley roof to roof terrace.

The Party Wall notices that I submitted were identical, i.e. all detailed items 1, 2, 3 and 4. The left hand side is the concern however in my opinion they do not have any say on item 3 as it does not apply to their side.

Item 4 they do have a say on and that is understandable. Item 4 is the lowest priority.

Items 1 and 2 are extremely important as every day that passes is costing me money.

It is my understanding that Party Wall agreements must be in place if any changes are to be made to the party wall, however what if I were to remove the structural timber frame and insert an RSJ in exactly the same position that the timber currently connects into without making any changes to the wall itself?

Quoted from the Party Wall Act:

The most commonly used rights
are:
• to repair a party wall
• to insert a damp proof course
• to underpin the whole thickness of a party wall ( for example to prevent
settlement)
• to cut into a party wall to take the bearing of a beam (for example for a loft
conversion).
• to raise the height of a party wall (for example adding another storey).
• to raise a party wall downwards (for example to form a basement)
• to demolish and rebuild a party wall (for example if it is structurally defective).
• to underpin the whole thickness of a party wall (for example to form a
basement)
• to cut off projections from a party wall (or from an adjoining owner’s boundary
or external wall) if necessary to build a new wall adjacent to that wall (for
example removing a chimney breast).


From this I understand that I am entitled to install an RSJ without PW agreement as long as I do not cut into the wall any more than currently exists. No doubt this will cause an inconvenience but I would rather try and work around an inconvenience than pay out thousands in surveyor's fees.
 
Sponsored Links
Considering the works could potentially affect three parties, I'd seek professional advice and look at engaging a Party Wall Surveyor. Yes they charge and prices vary. The costs only really start to escalate if the PWS is called out to asses the works as they progress. Otherwise, they'd inspect at the beginning, at the end and issue the necessary paperwork.

I don't understand the works you're proposing either. With regards to no.1, what do you mean you're replacing a structural timber wall with an RSJ & connecting into the party wall using existing holes? Don't you mean you're replacing a timber beam that 'supports' a load bearing wall with an RSJ? If so, unless the existing beam is supported on concrete padstones or steel plates, which I don't think either are present (as may only be a timber plate), then you will be carrying out structural alterations to the party wall.

Put the boot on the other foot... would you be happy if your neighbour was proposing similar works without engaging a professional? I know I wouldn't.
 
To clarify the works - yes, the timber beams (which form part of 1st & 2nd floor structural walls) are to be replaced with RSJs.

Advice from a chartered surveyor has been already been sought and a feasibility study produced. The works are viable and calculations/designs need now need to be created for the works. Building Control approval is in process.

My concern is the supposed need for Party Wll agreements and since one neighbour has rejected time has also become a concern.

Having read into the Party Wall Act in detail I am questioning the definition of what is required. If an opening already exists upon timber beam/wall removal, is PW approval required if RSJ and padstone fit the opening? I think not.
 
The neighbours to the left (No.1) are NOT accepting of my plans.
What do you mean by that?

The PWA does not give your neighbour the right to stop you doing the work - a notice is not a request for permission.
 
Sponsored Links
If an opening already exists upon timber beam/wall removal, is PW approval required if RSJ and padstone fit the opening? I think not.

Much as I also hate the PWA, if you are putting additional load on the wall, then the Act applies.
(I assume that this would be the case, as presumably the load-bearing studwork is being replaced by the beam, which implies that the load from above would now go into the wall instead of the floor?).
 
If an opening already exists upon timber beam/wall removal, is PW approval required if RSJ and padstone fit the opening? I think not.

Much as I also hate the PWA, if you are putting additional load on the wall, then the Act applies.
(I assume that this would be the case, as presumably the load-bearing studwork is being replaced by the beam, which implies that the load from above would now go into the wall instead of the floor?).

Yes, what you have assumed is correct.

Was worth considering.
 
If you get on with your neighbours but the have dissented to the party wall notice then try to choose an agreed surveyor.

If you have done your research properly and supplied the correct party wall notice (depending on what you are doing, you have to pick the correction section of the act) then you should be aware of the following:

Once you gave them the party wall notice they had the option to do the following:

1: Agree (no problems they are happy)- Does not give your protection under the act.

2:Dissent with and agreed surveyor (Disagree to the works but have one surveyor acting for both of you). This is the cheapest option as one surveyor does the inspection. They act for the party wall, not for either you not your neighbour. Cost £600-£1000

3. Dissent and appoint your own surveyor. The most cocostlyption. You will have to employ a party wall surveyor each. You then need a third surveyor to ajadjudicatehe two who are acting for you inindividuallyThis is rarely needing for domestic changes. Possibly £1000 - £3000.

The party wall act is there to protect you if somtsomethings wrong by avoiding civil courts (which could be very costly).

While it can not stop you from going ahead withwith thek. With the amount of structural changes you wish to make. It is probably best to go by the book and keep thenthe neighbourspy.
 

DIYnot Local

Staff member

If you need to find a tradesperson to get your job done, please try our local search below, or if you are doing it yourself you can find suppliers local to you.

Select the supplier or trade you require, enter your location to begin your search.


Are you a trade or supplier? You can create your listing free at DIYnot Local

 
Sponsored Links
Back
Top