Is PowerFlush the solution ?

[skt1977]

This 3 bed house was built 15 years back and has the conventional cold water tank and a feed tank in the loft and hot water cyllinder in the box room cupboard. It is an IDEAL CLASSIC boiler. I bought this house 5 years back. For as far back as I remember ( at least last 2 winters ), the downstairs rads in the living and the kitchen do not heat up enough. It seems that, in the middle of winters, whatever little bit they heat up can't even be felt. Over all there are 8 RADS. The ones in the kitchen and living are the larger of the lot. I called BG for a new boiler quote. BG said, for a property this size, better put a new boiler & keep the existing system and not think of a COMBI because -
Both Kitchen and Shower can be used at the same time and also, seemingly the pipes going in to and coming out of the RADS are 10mm which make it unsuitable for COMBI. I am not really sure what width pipes constitute the network and no one talks about it. Also BG said, the pipes being narrow, we may not be able to powerflush it as that may introduce leaks.
I called an independant engineer thru a local newspaper AD who said, lets replace the motor and the 3 way valve and do a powerflush and I should be good. He also said he would put some thing in the RADS and come back after 2 weeks and clean it. He gave me a quote of £300. It soulds worth doing but I do not want to risk doing a powerflush if it can break something which I may not even come to know immediately. The boiler has never been serviced in my knowledge but seems to be working fine. I want to make it trouble free for the next 5-10 years as I am moving out of country for a good while and plan to let the house out.

Any advide is highly appreciated.

 

[kittedup]

Don't change that boiler! One of the best boilers ever made.

I'd look at flushing it and changing the pump and valves.

Ted

 

[PullerGas]

It not an old system really & you're clearly having some circulation problems. It may be worth spending the £300, as it should be an improvment. 10mm tube can be Powerflushed, while its not as good as a small bore system it can give you years of trouble free service.

If the 300 quid guy knows his onions you should be OK.

 

[PullerGas]

Don't change that boiler! One of the best boilers ever made.

I'd look at flushing it and changing the pump and valves.

Ted

I agree Ted, though they are prone to fan failure.

 

[skt1977]

I think, Unfortunately, there is no way of knowing how reliable a pro is unless they are tried, unless someone knows better. In this instance, I do not have recommendations for this guy and he is a random pick from the local newspaper.

Another point, The boiler is running fine despite no servicing and I do not feel like touching it for the fear of disturbing the good run but "Is a boiler service in order ?" Further, As I am likely to be away from the country for the foreseeable, Is the BG HomeCare cover worth the money or there are alternatives ? BG say they will do an inspection before offering to cover.

 

[alan333]

We had similar ie a 15 year old house we bought 5.5 years ago, an Ideal Classic boiler and traditional hot water tank, but ours has 12 rads, plumbed in 10mm pipe. We had the same problem of some rads not heating up properly, mainly two downstairs and two upstairs. Each time I've had a service done the guy has said the boilers are great and if it was his he wouldn't change it. He did add, however, that it uses a bit more gas than the modern ones, mainly due to the pilot light being permanently on.

We paid over the odds for Scottish Gas to do a powerflush, because their agreement isn't just to do a powerflush - it's to do anything required to get the system fully working. ie if they need to lift floorboards etc to clear a blockage it's all within their (extortionate) price. Their price also includes fitting a magnaclean style filter, and they also guarantee the system so if it ever needs flushed again it's on them, although I think that's also tied in with having a contract with them.

The powerflush was done and there was quite a bit of gunk in the system, but it didn't cure all the cold rads. The engineer came back a couple of days later and ended up back flushing the "bad" rads using an air blaster, which totally cured them.

This was about 7 months ago and our heating has never been so good. We now run the boiler cooler but all the rads are hotter than ever. They all heat up quick too, where in the past the cool ones took hours just to get tepid.

Hope this helps

 

[mcmoby69]

Any work on a CH system has a possibility of causing a leak. Simply draining down and re filling can cause it.
I have never power flushed a system, never needed to. There are plenty of plumbers who do actually know their trade and are good at it. You just have to find one.
10mm to small for a combi? Bullpoo.
Ask around and get someone recommended.

 

[PullerGas]

Any work on a CH system has a possibility of causing a leak. Simply draining down and re filling can cause it.
I have never power flushed a system, never needed to. There are plenty of plumbers who do actually know their trade and are good at it. You just have to find one.
10mm to small for a combi? Bullpoo.
Ask around and get someone recommended.

Not the case at all. 10mm is used extensively on new builds & all sorts of installation, like everything it has limitations. I've been in the Plumbing & Heating game for over 40 years, seen 10mm systems successfully installed in 1000s of homes. The problems arise when DaftyDIYers, Handymen & Cowboys use products that are not fit for purpose.

Central Heating needs design, careful design.......if you don't have the full knowledge - leave it alone!!
10mm TO small for a combi???!!.....complete & utter ballox!!!

 

[PullerGas]

We had similar ie a 15 year old house we bought 5.5 years ago, an Ideal Classic boiler and traditional hot water tank, but ours has 12 rads, plumbed in 10mm pipe. We had the same problem of some rads not heating up properly, mainly two downstairs and two upstairs. Each time I've had a service done the guy has said the boilers are great and if it was his he wouldn't change it. He did add, however, that it uses a bit more gas than the modern ones, mainly due to the pilot light being permanently on.

We paid over the odds for Scottish Gas to do a powerflush, because their agreement isn't just to do a powerflush - it's to do anything required to get the system fully working. ie if they need to lift floorboards etc to clear a blockage it's all within their (extortionate) price. Their price also includes fitting a magnaclean style filter, and they also guarantee the system so if it ever needs flushed again it's on them, although I think that's also tied in with having a contract with them.

The powerflush was done and there was quite a bit of gunk in the system, but it didn't cure all the cold rads. The engineer came back a couple of days later and ended up back flushing the "bad" rads using an air blaster, which totally cured them.

This was about 7 months ago and our heating has never been so good. We now run the boiler cooler but all the rads are hotter than ever. They all heat up quick too, where in the past the cool ones took hours just to get tepid.

Hope this helps

I'm pleased you got sorted mate. You had someone that know what they were doing, not that I'm a fan of BG!! Oh FFS no!

 

[muggles]

I think, Unfortunately, there is no way of knowing how reliable a pro is unless they are tried, unless someone knows better. In this instance, I do not have recommendations for this guy and he is a random pick from the local newspaper.

With Berkshire being rather large, it's hard to tell exactly where you are. Nevertheless, if you put your postcode into www.buywithconfidence.gov.uk, you'll get a list of Trading Standards Approved professionals who are all vetted and monitored by Trading Standards. This should ensure that you get a great standard of work.

Another point, The boiler is running fine despite no servicing and I do not feel like touching it for the fear of disturbing the good run but "Is a boiler service in order ?" Further, As I am likely to be away from the country for the foreseeable, Is the BG HomeCare cover worth the money or there are alternatives ? BG say they will do an inspection before offering to cover.

Yes, you should have your boiler serviced annually. As said, these boilers are generally extremely robust and I certainly wouldn't change it, but the right TLC by a qualified professional will ensure that it gives many more years of operation. I wonder whether you take the same attitude with your car - "it's running fine so I won't bother to get it serviced..."? I suspect not...

If you're going to rent your house out, you'll need a landlords' gas safety assessment to be carried out as well, as you'll need a certificate prior to renting.

BG Homecare is very rarely worth the money, and certainly not in your case. Look at the premiums, then put that amount of money away in a bank account every month so that you can pay your local reliable independent when you need to. It'll save you money.

 

[ollski]

Crossed wires on the pipe size being unsuitable for a combi?, perhaps suggesting gas pipe was too small?. 10mm will powerflush ok if the drops are off decent sized circuits but it will almost certainly need doing manually if they are connected to manifold or two. Generally blow the pipes through with a footpump individually, remove the rads and hose through and then flush with the machine.