Loft lighting and socket circuits, on plugs. Allowed?

[f0rmula]

I was speaking to a colleague about his loft lighting and sockets. It emerged that he put them in himself, but said it wasn't notifiable as the sockets and lighting circuits are just plugged into a socket in the hallway.

That seems a bit wrong, but I don't know what (specifically) would be disallowed. Perhaps that they're both 'permanent' circuits, in the fact that some of the wiring is hidden beneath the loft boarding? They're both plugged into a socket, so he's not touched anything on the main wiring.

I'm about to start a re-wire, having given buildings notice. He's suggested, as we're living in the house, do the usual checks on the lighting circuit, then put a flex on and plug it into one of our existing sockets. It would only become notifiable when I wanted to connect the circuit to the new consumer unit. This would obviously make our lives a lot easier while I'm in the process of rewiring, but definitely seems wrong to me.

Any opinions welcome...

 

[bernardgreen]

It is almost certainly notifiable work to open the CU and disconnect the wires from an MCB and neutral bar.

 

[f0rmula]

It is almost certainly notifiable work to open the CU and disconnect the wires from an MCB and neutral bar.

I'd go further than 'almost certainly', but that's not what I was asking about.

He's put sockets and lighting throughout his loft, with the circuits being pretty permanent, but they're powered from a socket. He's not touched the consumer unit.

I will install a new consumer unit. He's suggested I install and test a lighting circuit, but could then power the lighting from a flex/plug and an existing socket while I install the rest of the circuits.

 

[bernardgreen]

I will install a new consumer unit. He's suggested I install and test a lighting circuit,

I assume you have lights at the moment.

How will you dis-connect and make safe the old and existing lighting cables ?

If he has suggested that and installed "semi permanent" sockets by plugging them into a socket then his advice is likely to be in-accurate and quite possibly liable to create hazards for you. Physical and legal hazards.

 

[f0rmula]

I will install a new consumer unit. He's suggested I install and test a lighting circuit,

I assume you have lights at the moment.

How will you dis-connect and make safe the old and existing lighting cables ?

Electrician across the road is coming over to disconnect the old circuits (only two, sockets and lighting) and put a couple of RCD'd sockets next to the existing consumer unit. The existing install will be dead, apart from these two sockets. (new CU is going in a different place)

If he has suggested that and installed "semi permanent" sockets by plugging them into a socket then his advice is likely to be in-accurate and quite possibly liable to create hazards for you. Physical and legal hazards.

Cheers for the reply. OK. I didn't think what he'd done/suggested was strictly allowed, but I couldn't tell him why.

 

[viewer]

If he has used T&E cable then it's a no, but if he has simply put a long flex on a multi way socket extension then there is no rule broken and it should be safe as it is protected by the 13A max fuse and the RCCD. It sounds as if his loft light is plugged into the multi-way so no problem if he's fitted a suitable fuse in the plug.
Semi-permanent, meaning that it just stays there and/or is fastened out of the way, is probably safer than using an extension which is unreeled for every use because there will be no wear and tear on the cable or fittings and no danger of (humans) tripping as it dangles from the access hatch.
For yourself, if it is just a loft then the power needed would be for what? Extension lamp, fan perhaps? If it is for living, railways, etc then a different ball game.
If you're putting in a lighting circuit as a new/replacement into the loft area then any aerials can be powered from that circuit.

 

[f0rmula]

If he has used T&E cable then it's a no, but if he has simply put a long flex on a multi way socket extension then there is no rule broken and it should be safe as it is protected by the 13A max fuse and the RCCD. It sounds as if his loft light is plugged into the multi-way so no problem if he's fitted a suitable fuse in the plug.
Semi-permanent, meaning that it just stays there and/or is fastened out of the way, is probably safer than using an extension which is unreeled for every use because there will be no wear and tear on the cable or fittings and no danger of (humans) tripping as it dangles from the access hatch.
For yourself, if it is just a loft then the power needed would be for what? Extension lamp, fan perhaps? If it is for living, railways, etc then a different ball game.
If you're putting in a lighting circuit as a new/replacement into the loft area then any aerials can be powered from that circuit.

Ah. It's twin and earth. The flex that runs to the plug, but the circuits, for the most part, are t&e. So that's why it's disallowed? No fixed non-trivial t&e, only flex?

He was suggesting there was nothing stopping me wiring my lighting circuits (upstairs and downstairs) and running them from an RCD socket to give us lighting in the 'living' part of the house, not just the loft, while I do the rest of the rewire. That seemed totally wrong.

Thanks for the clarification.

 

[NewOrder]

One of my friends did something similar. His upstairs lights were wired in lead sheath so he rewired it in PVC. However he didn't want to touch the CU (I dread to think how old it is) so he wired the entire upstairs lights using a FCU connected to a socket.

Really not ideal but I can't see it being dangerous in itself, but as for the rest of his installation that is a different matter!

 

[viewer]

As per Joydivision; if the T&E goes from fittings to a fixed FCU and then flex to a plug no reason why it shouldn't be safe. T&E cannot be used directly to a plug. Apologies for any confusion. Similarly, if you put in the fixed lighting and terminating in a fixed FCU with 5A fuse (with sufficient cable to connect to CU later) then you could put a flex from the FCU and plug into a RCCD protected socket without any safety problems. This should help your re-wiring. The big danger with a mixed T&E/flex plug-in system is that the T&E part could be mis-identified and connected to a live circuit thus giving a live plug.

 

[f0rmula]

Ah. OK. I worry a little about making any fixed circuit live before it's been inspected (even though I can perform the regular tests). I may do that if it takes a lot longer than I expect it to, or the GF gets too stressy about having to use lamps.

Thanks a lot for all of your input.