Messed up telephone wiring, help please!

[RhysJames2008]

Hi there,
I desperately need help, and im going to try and explain my problem as best I can.

Basically, the first socket I have coming in from the main line is in the hallway. There is an extension running from this socket to the main house phone and the broadband router. There is another cable extended from this socket to the Sky box.

There is another extension socket upstairs, and when I plug this into the main phone socket in the hallway, all of the broadband and phone goes offline for some reason, but starts working again when I unplug this extension.

Im pretty sure the wiring is correct because the phone and broadband work when this extension isnt plugged in.

What could be my problem and what is my solution?

Also, this may be of help. I do not seem to have a Master socket, the first socket in a Slave socket in the hallway, but there is a small box in the hallway too with BT on it which has solid connectors inside.

Do I need a Master socket?

Many thanks
Rhys

 

[bigzed]

Rhys, you must have a master socket somewhere in the house, otherwise your phones would not ring. The master socket, whether old style or one of the newer nte5's ( with the detachable lower plate ) is wired internally to allow the ringing current to pass to the sounder/bell in the phone.

I would hazard a guess ( seeing as you say you have to plug the upstairs extension in ) that you have one of the nasty plug-in extension leads pre-wired with a socket on the end of it and it has gone faulty.

Is the small terminal block in your hallway a rounded oblong shape with screw terminals inside ? This type of block used to be used to changeover/extend the old type of flat twin dropwire coming into your house to allow fitting of the old style krone masters ( which wouldn't accept the thicker conductors ), or a direct connection to the old Dial-type phones.

It is easy to tell which socket is the master. Take off the front plate and have a look at the back of the socket. If there is a Yellow capacitor and a resistor on the back, that will be the master. If there is nothing there apart from the Krone terminals, that is a slave.

Can you provide pics ?

 

[plugwash]

are you sure the first socket is an extention socket and not an old style master socket (the only difference is whether certain components are present on the back, the ringing capacitor)

Also if you are using ADSL you don't strictly need a master socket as the ringer signal is generated at the filters, the ringing cap in the master socket is redundant (still a good idea to have a master socket present though so you have the surge arrester).

anyway it sounds like your plug in extention to upstairs has a short circuit. Can the phone point upstairs be opened and if so how many wires are there, what color and in what terminals?

do you have a multimeter? if not get one.

 

[emphasis303]

Hi

You might just have too many sockets, I had a friend who had this problem he installed something like a booster or something and all was ok.

I too suffered this when I added an extra socket but my problem was all the phones would be very faint. As soon as i disconnected the extra one all was good.

I think its a max of 3 extensions im not sure maybe someone on here knows

 

[bigzed]

Every ringing item of eqpt that is connected to a phone line has a Ringer Equivalence Number ( REN ) BT state that this should not exceed 4, or they cannot guarantee that all the phones etc will ring. You can connect as many sockets as you like ( as long as you have one master to the remaining slaves ).
In practice, this is also affected by how far from the exch you are. I have been on faults where the subscriber has been so far from the exchange that only two phones would ring.

I would still suggest that the extn that you are "plugging in" is at fault here.

 

[bernardgreen]

You might just have too many sockets, I had a friend who had this problem he installed something like a booster or something and all was ok.

Number of sockets will not affect volume significantly.

Number of micro filters with attached phone with ringer will affect volume.

System is designed to work with ONE bell capacitor ( in the master socket ) feeding the bells / ringers. Micro filters each have a bell capacitor. More capacitors means more speech power can be lost in bells and ringers of phones that have not been picked up.

Best option is to separate phone wiring from ASDL wiring at the master socket and have one capacitor in the master feeding all phone bells and ringers via wire 3.

Micro filters are a bodge to get ADSL into homes without the expense / inconvenience of re-wiring the internal phone wiring.

 

[RetiredCableGuy]

The fault clearly lies with the plug-in extension from the hallway socket. It could either be a damaged cable, causing a short between the 'legs' of the line; a faulty connector/socket at either end again causing a short; or it could be a faulty phone/device plugged into the upstairs socket.

Firstly, unplug the phone from the upstairs extension while the extension is connected & see what happens. If everything comes back on, you know the phone is faulty. If everything is still off you know its the wiring.

In the latter case, inspect the cable for any damage. Also check the socket/connector for any shorts or damp/oxidisation.

Last resort, rewire the upstairs extension.

 

[RhysJames2008]

Thank you very much for all of the replies. I had a mate who is an engineer come round to rewire the upstairs extension but I haven't tested it out yet. I'm going to post some pictures on here which I hope should be of help to you.
I guess the first socket is a master socket but it doesnt have a removable plate. Its identical to a slave socket and it is definately the first socket entering the house. So im assuming its one of those old fashioned master sockets.
This first socket has the upstairs extension coming off it (currently unplugged, because it is not wired directly inside) It also has an extension going to the kitchen which I believe is hard-wired, and an extension which the Sky Engineer fitted for the Sky box.
It is really confusing... the guy who lived in this house before me did EVERYTHING himself and he made a mess of every last inch of this house.

Anyway, pictures are on there way.

Regards,
Rhys