Mezzanine on Second Floor

[maravilla]

I am looking at purchasing a duplex apartment in a three story building.

Before purchasing this property, I want to know whether or not a mezzanine (for use as a bedroom and so a habitable space) on the second floor is feasible (both financially and from a building/fire regs perspective), which is what I am hoping you will be able to assist me with! Or if there is other alternatives which would be more cost effective or be easier to meet the relevant regulations.

I have attached a floor plan of the property I am interested in. Below the ground floor of the property is a basement which is predominantly above ground level, and as such, without measuring it (which I am planning to do on second viewing next week), I am certain a mezzanine on the second floor would be above 4.5m above ground level, which makes things frustratingly more complex.

On the attached floor plan, my original thought would be for the mezzanine to be over the lounge, coming out to around the middle of the room, just before the end of the staircase from the ground floor.

I would appreciate any advice on the measures I would need to take and any hurdles I would need to jump over for this to work.

I have read the relevant building regulations (Approved Document B) and have tried my best to get my head around it.

I gather that if the mezzanine floor is over 4.5m above ground level, I would need to install a fire resistant staircase leading to the exit from the property.

Any advice would be much appreciated! I love the property but the first bedroom is really only a small single, hence why I would like to add a mezzanine bedroom if possible, as the first floor has lovely high ceilings which could easily accommodate another level.

 

[Doggit]

I can't comment on the planning regs, or whether the 4.5m regulation refers to the ouside ground level, or the one defined by the front doo that would then take you to safety.

If you're going to install a mezzanine, then you're into party wall agreements with both the neighbours to make sure nothing gets damaged whilst you're putting in the steel beams to support the mezzanine floor. But looking at the ground floor plans, I suspect that the layout was determined by the location of the front door, so I'd be inclined to think about moving the front door, and then changing the layout, and this wouldn't be cheap, but might be the less problematic solution. Mezannine bedrooms are normally designed for when you're the only person/couple in the property, and you've got 2 rooms, and an open staircase, so no privacy for the mezzanine. The staircase seems to come up into the kitchen end,and that would mean putting the mezzanine over the kitchen so that the staircases are kept parallel

Where does bedroom 1 get it's light and ventilation from, and do you know the width of the property. Do you have a budget or a reserve to do the work.

 

[maravilla]

I can't comment on the planning regs, or whether the 4.5m regulation refers to the ouside ground level, or the one defined by the front doo that would then take you to safety.

If you're going to install a mezzanine, then you're into party wall agreements with both the neighbours to make sure nothing gets damaged whilst you're putting in the steel beams to support the mezzanine floor. But looking at the ground floor plans, I suspect that the layout was determined by the location of the front door, so I'd be inclined to think about moving the front door, and then changing the layout, and this wouldn't be cheap, but might be the less problematic solution. Mezannine bedrooms are normally designed for when you're the only person/couple in the property, and you've got 2 rooms, and an open staircase, so no privacy for the mezzanine. The staircase seems to come up into the kitchen end,and that would mean putting the mezzanine over the kitchen so that the staircases are kept parallel

Where does bedroom 1 get it's light and ventilation from, and do you know the width of the property. Do you have a budget or a reserve to do the work.

I've looked around regarding the 4.5m rule - it would be great if it was 4.5m from the ground level of the property - would save a lot of hassle with fire protecting staircases etc, but haven't found a definitive answer to this as of yet. Saw a few suggestions that it is 4.5m from ground level outside so that if you did need to escape from that floor you could do so without serious injury.

I hadn't really thought about the mezzanine going over the kitchen - not sure why - as you say it would probably be more practical and would save room keeping the staircase parallel.

Bedroom 1 is at the front of the property, so there is not another flat next to bedroom 1. So it has windows out onto the front of the property.

I am yet to get the full plans from the vendor, but judging by the other flats in the building and from my first viewing I would estimate the width of the property is around 3 - 3.5m.

In an ideal world I would like to get the work started as soon as I complete, and would probably have a budget of around £10,000 - £15,000 to do it straight away. Whether this is even remotely enough I'm not sure. Prices I have seen online vary massively. If I were to wait a year to start the work I would probably have a budget of £25,000. Think the downstairs could have been used better to be honest, the W/C is unnecessary with a bathroom already on the floor, I figured the developer has added this for a better sale price. I'd have preferred a bigger first bedroom and no W/C!

 

[Doggit]

So both bedroom 1 and 2, and the bathroom have windows on to the front of the property. Most designs like this are front to back, but this seems to strech side to side.

where is the front door then, is it to the left hand side, or also on the front.

 

[maravilla]

Apologies, I should have added the windows onto the floor plan. The bathroom does not have a window, bedroom one has windows onto the front of the property, and bedroom 2 has a window facing out to the side of the property (opposite wall to the front door).

The entrance door to the communal corridor is on the front of the property and the corridor runs down the left hand side of the flats/apartments, with the front door to the apartment immediately to the right upon entry into the corridor.

 

[Doggit]

I think I need some pictures before I can go much further, and trust me, some of my ideas may be off the wall, but I suspect the layout change will be more sensible than the mezzanine.

There's nothing to the left of the bathroom, so could bedroom be moved there. This assumes that you move the door further back, and change the stairs round, and the bathroom then goes between the two bedrooms. I know it sounds a lot, and you'd need to get permission from the freeholder to move the door, and get a window in the new bedroom position, but it should be well within your budget, and make the property a much beter 2 bedder.

 

[^woody^]

A fire alarm system and supression (ie sprinkler or mist) would normally be an option instead of a protected staircase.

 

[Doggit]

I got away with an interlink set of smoke alarms

 

[^woody^]

I got away with an interlink set of smoke alarms

On a three-storey property with an open plan lounge and kitchen with the only escape from a sleeping area through the two highest risk rooms in a home?

 

[John D v2.0]

Does sound unlikely, although it does seem the regs spirit are slightlymore focused on how quickly people realise there's a fire over the actual rooms that you have to go through.
But for 3 floors you'd need a safe way out regardless!

 

[maravilla]

Thanks for your replies.

I too had read about sprinkler systems, but wasn't sure if this was acceptable as a replacement for a fire protected staircase?

Spoke to building control at my council yesterday. He didn't sound too certain himself but his interpretation of the 4.5m from ground floor rule, was that this is from the level of the ground outside the building.

Having read document b for flats again, I think this is the key bit:

Provisions for flats with a floor more
than 4.5m above ground level
Internal planning of flats
2.13 Three acceptable approaches (all of which
should observe the restrictions concerning inner
rooms given in paragraph 2.5) when planning a
flat which has a floor at more than 4.5m above
ground level are:
a. to provide a protected entrance hall which
serves all habitable rooms, planned so that
the travel distance from the entrance door to
the door to any habitable room is 9m or less
(see Diagram 2); or
b. to plan the flat so that the travel distance
from the entrance door to any point in any
of the habitable rooms does not exceed 9m
and the cooking facilities are remote from
the entrance door and do not prejudice
the escape route from any point in the flat
(see Diagram 3); or
c. to provide an alternative exit from the flat,
complying with paragraph 2.14.

Think I need to get down to the property with a measuring tape!

 

[Doggit]

On a three-storey property with an open plan lounge and kitchen with the only escape from a sleeping area through the two highest risk rooms in a home?

It's now 5 storeys. Basement with open plan kitchen and dining area, Ground floor with through lounge to front door, but it's only 10 feet from the stairs to the front door. 1st floor with 2 bedrooms, 2nd floor with bedroom and bathroom, and loft room. The only room that you have to go through if there's a fire, is the lounge, but you can also go out the back door at far end of the lounge.

 

[^woody^]

The requirements for fire safety are now less prescriptive and more 'risk based'. So seemingly similar properties may require different measures for fire safety.