New member needing advice

[CarolineWSL]

Hi all. Nice to be here.

I am a newbie to this site and a recently new to electrics. I have come across a problem - which I think should be simple - but it is baffling me and I can't understand what I am doing wrong. I am hoping that some kind knowledgeable person on here can help!

I am trying to remove a dusk till dawn sensor from an outside lighting circuit and replace with a switch. I have removed the sensor to find a 3 core plus earth cable (this doesn't help me!). I have tried to install a switch straight to where the sensor was - unsuccessfully! I have managed to change it with a normal PIR detector and wired as brown - live, grey neutral, black - light load and tried doing some daylight testing but couldn't - although the sensor does work at night. I really want only a switch but don't know how to do this. Am I able to have a switch running from the sensor to override it? Or even better, only a switch!

I don't understand why I can't get any lights to come on in daylight! Could there be another dusk till dawn sensor on the circuit which is stopping me being able to turn lights on during the day?

Any help would be much appreciated. I am confused and frustrated!

 

[endecotp]

I have tried to install a switch straight to where the sensor was - unsuccessfully

How exactly did you connect it, and what exactly happened?

Probably you should connect your switch between the live and switched live wires, and leave the neutral disconnected (safely, in a terminal block).
I think that means between brown and black.

 

[SimonH2]

... I think that means between brown and black.

Does it ? It depends on how the original circuit was wired. I would consider it logical to use black for neutral, but AIUI there is a standard that says black should be the switched live and grey should be neutral.
So for the OP, I would suggest looking at where this 3 core+E cable goes and see how it's wired.

 

[endecotp]

That's based on:

I have managed to change it with a normal PIR detector and wired as brown - live, grey neutral, black - light load and tried doing some daylight testing but couldn't - although the sensor does work at night.

 

[CarolineWSL]

I tried most combinations with a few blows from the consumer unit. brown to com and either black or grey to L1 didn't blow but I couldn't get the lights working! I obviously cannot see how original wires have been connected as out of reach. So frustrating but thanks for help so far....

 

[securespark]

Is this sensor outside?

You could fit an IP rated switch, like this one, http://www.screwfix.com/p/bg-1-gang-2-way-single-pole-slim-weatherproof-switch/42402 or this one, http://www.screwfix.com/p/bg-nexus-...odSmAD8g#product_additional_details_container , and use the neutral (along with the permanent live) to wire in a locator neon.

 

[endecotp]

I tried most combinations with a few blows from the consumer unit.

This is not the recommended approach.

brown to com and either black or grey to L1 didn't blow

I conclude from this that brown is switched live. (Others agree?)

but I couldn't get the lights working!

Then I think something is broken or not as you've described.

Do you own a multimeter?

 

[CarolineWSL]

I have tried connecting a similar IP rated switch. Its hard to know what is neutral - switched live etc as cant see other end of cables. I know blows at CU aren't good but this is really frustrating me. I don't own a multimeter - yet. Not sure which wires to go where with a neon switch. Thank you all for your help so far. Much appreciated....

 

[CarolineWSL]

Can I connect another cable to the new PIR sensor for a switch? eg: wire at sensor and connect to switch?

 

[securespark]

I conclude from this that brown is switched live. (Others agree?)

Yes. But if the either the Black or Grey were an energised line in, then the light ought to illuminate.

 

[securespark]

Not sure which wires to go where with a neon switch.

When you find out which is which, the permanent live would go to the common, along with one of the neon leads.

The switched live to L1. The neutral and the other neon lead together in a separate terminal block.

 

[endecotp]

Can I connect another cable to the new PIR sensor for a switch?

If connecting the switch directly doesn't work, then this won't work either.

 

[endecotp]

I don't own a multimeter - yet.

Get one, it will make everything much easier.

 

[333rocky333]

Yes. But if the either the Black or Grey were an energised line in, then the light ought to illuminate.

At a quess maybe the switch has blown open circuit due to the wrong attempts previously

 

[333rocky333]

I tried most combinations with a few blows from the consumer unit. brown to com and either black or grey to L1 didn't blow but I couldn't get the lights working! I obviously cannot see how original wires have been connected as out of reach. So frustrating but thanks for help so far....

Do you remember what combo DID trip the fuse