New Vaillant boiler

[chieflasagnaeater]

I'm just about to shell out nearly a grand on a Vaillant 831 NG Condensing combi.
It will replace my old limping Biasi combi.

Is it advisable to get my system powerflushed? and has anyone heard about a device called a magnaclean for £100. Will it be worth the extra expense.

Thanks all.

 

[Agile]

Whats wrong with your biasi?

What benefit do you expect to get from a new boiler?

Tony

 

[bobw1956]

Yes it is advisable to have a power flush,& yes magnacleans are a good investment,clean systems are a must,& a very good choise in boilers.

 

[Deleted member 105431]

Yes it is advisable to have a power flush,& yes magnacleans are a good investment,clean systems are a must,& a very good choise in boilers.

ditto.

 

[chieflasagnaeater]

My Biasi has been costing me a hundred quid here and there since moving in 2 years ago.
First off the air pressure switch was suspected and it turned out to be debris build up on the venturi.
Recently I've needed to turn on the DHW to get the CH to engage..suspected ignition box which turns out to be a misaligned flue fan.
It's also a struggle to get a decent hot bath which is still not really understood after a Kamco clean.

My decision to replace was also helped along because of a very new arrival to the family which means the wife & little'n will be home all day. All this coupled with peace of mind (3 yr warranty) and the hope of lower gas bills (modulating Vaillant rather than constant full throttle from the Biasi).

It's a big investment but I honestly can't wait to retire the pesky Biasi. What's probably most annoying is knowing it will need more expert trouble shooting in future which never quite hits the spot. Not that I can blame plumbers - it's obviously just a black art!

Thanks for the advice to power flush and re the cleaning gizmo.

 

[Agile]

My Biasi has been costing me a hundred quid here and there since moving in 2 years ago.
First off the air pressure switch was suspected and it turned out to be debris build up on the venturi.

Any competent boiler engineer would always check the venturi before changing the APS. I hope you did not pay your nupty for an APS which was not needed?

Recently I've needed to turn on the DHW to get the CH to engage..suspected ignition box which turns out to be a misaligned flue fan.
It's also a struggle to get a decent hot bath which is still not really understood after a Kamco clean.

You have not made this very clear. The ignition PCB does not know what the heat is to be used for. Poor DHW is usually a partially blocked plate heat exchanger. If you have to turn on DHW before the CH will fire that implies a flow switch problem which is often a blocked CH circuit or a failing pump.

I cannot imagine how the fan can ever be misalligned! If it somehow was it must have been from when the venturi was cleaned after wrongly replacing the APS

My decision to replace was also helped along because of a very new arrival to the family which means the wife & little'n will be home all day. All this coupled with peace of mind (3 yr warranty) and the hope of lower gas bills (modulating Vaillant rather than constant full throttle from the Biasi).

I am sorry if I sound rather patronising but that is total nonsence! The Biasi is a fully modulating boiler and the burner pressure modulates from 1.5 mB to 10.5 mB. Of course if your nupty has misadjusted it then it will not be working as intended!

It's a big investment but I honestly can't wait to retire the pesky Biasi. What's probably most annoying is knowing it will need more expert trouble shooting in future which never quite hits the spot. Not that I can blame plumbers - it's obviously just a black art!

Biasi 24S/28S are very simple boilers and any competent boiler engineers will have no difficulty. Of course if you employ a nupty plumber then you only have yourself to blame!

Thanks for the advice to power flush and re the cleaning gizmo.

If the hot water output is adequate then I cannot see any good reason for replacing your existing boiler.

The Vaillants are towards the leading edge of domestic boiler technology and few installers can do anything other then fit them on the wall. You already have had a nupty fiddling with your Biasi to the extent that you now want to replace a perfectly good boiler. Vaillants are much more intolerant of nupties than Biasis!

The Vaillant will save up to 12% of the gas bill but the installation cost will take 10-20 years to recover based on that saving.!

Tony

 

[chieflasagnaeater]

My Biasi has been costing me a hundred quid here and there since moving in 2 years ago.
First off the air pressure switch was suspected and it turned out to be debris build up on the venturi.

Any competent boiler engineer would always check the venturi before changing the APS. I hope you did not pay your nupty for an APS which was not needed?

Yep, paid him good money. Yellow Pages hey! So I have a perfectly good working spare APS if anybody wants it..will post it free as well.

Recently I've needed to turn on the DHW to get the CH to engage..suspected ignition box which turns out to be a misaligned flue fan.
It's also a struggle to get a decent hot bath which is still not really understood after a Kamco clean.

You have not made this very clear. The ignition PCB does not know what the heat is to be used for. Poor DHW is usually a partially blocked plate heat exchanger. If you have to turn on DHW before the CH will fire that implies a flow switch problem which is often a blocked CH circuit or a failing pump.

My fault here. There are 2 issues: The DHW does not get that hot - plumber said the heat exchanger probably needs descaling, which I except.

I cannot imagine how the fan can ever be misalligned! If it somehow was it must have been from when the venturi was cleaned after wrongly replacing the APS
I think you may be right that it could have been poorly reassembled. It was my good friend who misdiagnosed the APS.

My decision to replace was also helped along because of a very new arrival to the family which means the wife & little'n will be home all day. All this coupled with peace of mind (3 yr warranty) and the hope of lower gas bills (modulating Vaillant rather than constant full throttle from the Biasi).

I am sorry if I sound rather patronising but that is total nonsence! The Biasi is a fully modulating boiler and the burner pressure modulates from 1.5 mB to 10.5 mB. Of course if your nupty has misadjusted it then it will not be working as intended!
Fair enough - I don't know about modulation.

It's a big investment but I honestly can't wait to retire the pesky Biasi. What's probably most annoying is knowing it will need more expert trouble shooting in future which never quite hits the spot. Not that I can blame plumbers - it's obviously just a black art!

Biasi 24S/28S are very simple boilers and any competent boiler engineers will have no difficulty. Of course if you employ a nupty plumber then you only have yourself to blame!

How do you spot a nupty?

Thanks for the advice to power flush and re the cleaning gizmo.

If the hot water output is adequate then I cannot see any good reason for replacing your existing boiler.
How much money should you throw at something that's 10 years old and seems to be failing regularly. Granted the new machine may also give grief but surely the odds are reduced.

The Vaillants are towards the leading edge of domestic boiler technology and few installers can do anything other then fit them on the wall. You already have had a nupty fiddling with your Biasi to the extent that you now want to replace a perfectly good boiler. Vaillants are much more intolerant of nupties than Biasis!

The Vaillant will save up to 12% of the gas bill but the installation cost will take 10-20 years to recover based on that saving.!

Thanks Tony, I plan to track useage cost of the Vaillant and compare to my Biasi so will come back to this post sometime.

Tony

 

[David937]

May I ask, how do you know that he has a 24S/28S?

Oops just checked he has a 28S

 

[BigBurner]

Before you pay a lot of money for an average boiler, check out the Remeha Broag 39C combi. It has integral weather compensation as standard, which is extra on other models. Get the outside temperature senor and connect it up. Better quality than a Vaillant and a superior control system....and cheaper too.

Fit a Magnaclean on the CH return. The DHW delivery is excellent and you will not look back. And better in the pocket too.

 

[David937]

 

[gas4you]

Before you pay a lot of money for n average boiler, check out the Remeha Broag 39C combi. It has integral weather compensation as standard, which is extra on other models. Get the outside temperature senor and connect it up. Better quality than a Vaillant and a superior control system....and cheaper too.

Its cheaper because it IS NOT better quality. When will you get this basic fact of life Bigwaterdrivel.

Until you have the experience of fitting both I suggest you keep it shut and stop giving incorrect advice

 

[BigBurner]

Before you pay a lot of money for n average boiler, check out the Remeha Broag 39C combi. It has integral weather compensation as standard, which is extra on other models. Get the outside temperature senor and connect it up. Better quality than a Vaillant and a superior control system....and cheaper too.

Its cheaper because it IS NOT better quality.

It is cheaper, better, quality and a superior design a with a superior control system. The non-combi boilers are "dual temperature" boilers which are rare and generally expensive. Vaillant need to get their boilers up to date, get the prices down and quality up. Until then better price/performance is around.

Many here work for Vaillant, get good markup on them or just don't know anything else.

Good independent solid advice is needed and I give that. If Vaillant get their act together I would recommend them, also it is difficult to recommend them. I generally would give W-Bosch a wide berth too.

Remeha are a large Dutch company and do a lot of commercial boilers and are well established in the UK.

 

[gas4you]

You give everything a wide berth as you never fit or have fitted any make of boiler.

So you are, as always, mis-representing yourself to innocent posters.

You should make it perfectly clear that your only knowledge is gained from reading brochures and web sites that are available to the poster themselves.

You are not even qualified enough to receive full technical literature that us installers do.

I do not work for Vaillant, I just fit them because they are the best of the mass produced boilers.

I also fit Broag, if the customer wants a cheaper product that is not up to the same quality as the Vaillant, utilising components that Vaillant ditched from their main stream boilers a few years ago and are therefore now 'old hat' in boiler technology, whereas if the customer wants the absolute best I fit them an ATAG, THE best of the Dutch boilers.

The Broag is more akin to the Glow Worm Ultracom range of boilers in the parts it uses.

Stick that in your googling pipe and smoke it.

 

[Deleted member 105431]

Stick that in your googling pipe and smoke it.

well said!

 

[BigBurner]

You give everything a wide berth as you never fit or have fitted any make of boiler.

You are intimidated by my knowledge.

The Broag is more akin to the Glow Worm Ultracom range of boilers in the parts it uses.

No plastic, brass Honeywell hydroblock is used. Stainless steel Gianonni heat exchanger too. Superior all around. You clearly don't even know what OpenTherm control is, which Vaillant and Glow Worm do not have, never mind them lacking weather compensation, or what a "dual temperatures" boiler is. Please stick to changing bathrooms.