Oil Based Paint Systems

[michealangelo]

Well it seems despite what they say most seem to think oil still rules over water

Apart from the yellowing

 

[Wayners]

Nope. Definitely not imo.
It's just that application of waterbased is different and really needs to be sprayed.
If you can't spray then then correct brush and roller applied to the correct thickness. Many over brush and way to thinly.
Slow drying. Smell and the fact oil goes yellow within a few weeks plus no development has made oil obsolete.
Oil is said to be the best option for exterior.

 

[michealangelo]

Nope. Definitely not imo.
It's just that application of waterbased is different and really needs to be sprayed.
If you can't spray then then correct brush and roller applied to the correct thickness. Many over brush and way to thinly.
Slow drying. Smell and the fact oil goes yellow within a few weeks plus no development has made oil obsolete.
Oil is said to be the best option for exterior.

All the decorators I know use oil satin or equivalent as top finishing coat and most also oil undercoat on wood that needs good coverage

My recent stain block test told me water based products , in that respect , are ineffective

 

[michealangelo]

Would peeps rather finish with crown fastflow satin or oil based satin ?

To me there seems to be more body to oil based paints ....apart from high gloss .....and they are easier to apply .....certainly with brush ?

I don't mind using water based primer undercoats .....although again they need more coats in my view .....but a better coverage and finish is with oil ?

 

[ericmark]

We are at the point of giving up with oil based paints on wood, each year the bench seats are reviewed, they last between 1 and 5 years before the wood needs repainting, we have dismantled the benches and stored wood in the compressor room which is warm, to dry it out first, we have followed the instructions of primer, then under coat and finally top gloss coat, painting has to be in the winter and in a unheated damp warehouse but protected from rain, snow etc. Benches are collected after last train of the year, often the mince pie special around 28th December, and have to be back out at Easter.

We have had the paint peel off in sheets, on the cast iron no problem, just the wood, so we have decided to replace the wood with plastic, did the first bench last year, needed angle iron or box section under the plastic to stop it bending over time, but we hope the benches will then last at least 10 years before needing maintenance.

Water based paints do not seem to wear as well as oil, the bums moving on the seats actually wears the paint away, however it dries faster, and there is less worry of a run some where having un-dried paint which will transfer to clothing, but being a heritage railway we have to use GWR colours, and to get the colours in water based has been a problem.

The same paint which fails with benches which are wood, seems to be OK on wood buildings, however with buildings we cordon them off, and paint in the summer, thy to select a day when trains are not running, but buildings paint work gets less wear and tear.

Inside buildings you do not want the fumes, so oil is out, it has to be water based.

 

[opps]

A someone who spent years painting raw MDF cabinets there is no way I could achieve the same quality of finish with waterbased paints. My customers wanted a finish that looked like it had been sprayed and a final coat applied by hand with the slightest of tramlines. They wanted to see clean lines where the rails and stiles on doors meet.

At the risk of bigging myself up... in the 20+ years that I focused almost exclusively on painting cabinets, I only ever once saw another unit where the hand painted finish impressed me- and that too was oil based. Don't get me wrong, I have seen many waterbased hand painted kitchen units that are perfectly acceptable (normally primed with 1K paints).

I used to use 170mm Anza paint pads (they had no foam backing). With oil based paints I could get constant tramlines throughout an 8 by 4 sheet of MDF. The pads were faster than rolling the paint on and then laying it off with a brush- and the quality of finish was vastly superior. The hairs on pads are only a couple of mm.

Whilst I respect @Wayners opinion, I don't find that oil based paints yellow quickly these days. They did after the 2010 VOC compliance, but by about 2013/4 they had tweaked them and I honestly find that they yellow no faster than pre 2010 paints.

 

[opps]

being a heritage railway we have to use GWR colours, and to get the colours in water based has been a problem.

Don't they have RAL equivalents?

A quick google search seems to suggest that GWR Cream is in fact RAL 218- to be honest, it was the first GWR colour that I googled.

Brush Finish GWR Cream (218) | T&R Williamson, Ripon

Brush Finish GWR Cream (218) - Part of the Spec 81 range of premium paints from T&R Williamson, Ripon, Yorkshire

trwilliamson.co.uk

If that is the case, it should be available in a waterbased finish.

RAL colour standard - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

 

[ericmark]

Interesting, it seems our brown was too dark, likely some one colour matched and used a sample which had darkened with age or smoke, so we now have what we call baby poo brown, much lighter, it seems some one did some research into the correct colour, most of us preferred the old colour, but the powers in charge say must correct to the new lighter brown.

With plastic sleepers the colour does change batch to batch, and the benches are made from same recycled material, so no colour option, as a result seems likely we will get enough material to do all benches in one batch, so all same colour.

But the plastic lasts for years and years, seem odd that we get the plastic from processing wood?

 

[michealangelo]

Are oil based paints eventually going to be unavailable ?

I do understand the fumes thing though

A few days ago I was pottering around doing skirting boards

I used oil based zinser cover stain as my undercoat as its great coverage in my view and johnstones satinwood oil and by heck I am glad I had the windows open and even then it was tough going

 

[opps]

Are oil based paints eventually going to be unavailable ?

I don't see what the rationale for banning them would be. VOC wise, they have already massively reduced the levels.

 

[opps]

I used oil based zinser cover stain as my undercoat as its great coverage in my view and johnstones satinwood oil and by heck I am glad I had the windows open and even then it was tough going

Back when I was painting wardrobes, standing inside a double bay unit whilst painting it with oil based eggshell my eyes did water a tad.

 

[michealangelo]

Back when I was painting wardrobes, standing inside a double bay unit whilst painting it with oil based eggshell my eyes did water a tad.

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