Oops. A beam attached to the wall?

[ismellrainbows]

Hi everyone.

So I made the mistake of removing a wooden doorframe and it turns out there are lapped joists above and no lintel. This is an internal block wall.

Question: I would love to open up and expand the entryway completely, back to the exterior wall, BUT I don't want to pay for a structural engineer if this isn't possible. I have added diagrams containing all the details of what I am looking to do. All you knowledgeable people on here, is this possible? Could a beam somehow be hung on the exterior wall?

fyi: since this door is quite close to the staircase, a concrete lintel with bearings at each end would barely do anything in the way enlarging the doorway hence why I am asking whether all the way back is possible.

It's also weird to me how so many lapped joists were being supported by just a wooden frame.

Screenshot 2023-05-23 at 21.25.57.png

• ismellrainbows
• 23 May 2023

 

[noseall]

I'm gonna duck out of this one (hides behind sofa), sorry.

Job for the S.E.'s on here....

 

[George_engineer]

I don't want to pay for a structural engineer if this isn't possible

Anything is possible... you'll need some sort of beam but this could be timber or steel.

If they are local to you then a SE may just charge a call out fee to give a quick opinion.

 

[John D v2.0]

I can't answer other than to say anything is possible given the budget but a relevant question is, are the lapped joists floor joists or is this some kind of dormer bungalow?
If they happen to be below roof space it will be easier to support, but I'm guessing it's a more traditional layout upstairs.

 

[ismellrainbows]

I can't answer other than to say anything is possible given the budget but a relevant question is, are the lapped joists floor joists or is this some kind of dormer bungalow?
If they happen to be below roof space it will be easier to support, but I'm guessing it's a more traditional layout upstairs.

Yes, more traditional layout . The wall continues up into a bedroom wall. It's a two storey house.

Not too fussed about budget, I just can't for the life of me figure out how this could work with some basic knowledge I have.

 

[ismellrainbows]

I can't answer other than to say anything is possible given the budget but a relevant question is, are the lapped joists floor joists or is this some kind of dormer bungalow?
If they happen to be below roof space it will be easier to support, but I'm guessing it's a more traditional layout upstairs.

Question though, are all load bearing door frames H shaped? Because this wasn't. Hence why I am. even more confused on why it would be holding lapped joists

 

[cdbe]

Prop it up and stick a lintel in.

 

[ismellrainbows]

Prop it up and stick a lintel in.

So, a concrete lintel going into the external wall?

 

[cdbe]

I would use an heavy duty off the shelf steel box lintel rather than a concrete lintel if the joists are bearing directly onto it. I always feel the thin concrete lintels are better with a bit of masonry on top. You will need building control approval, you might get lucky and get some free suitability advice from the technical department of the lintel manufacturers if you can provide a clear drawing detailing the loading - otherwise you might get a bit of help from BC, or you'll have to bite the bullet and engage an SE.

 

[noseall]

I would use an heavy duty off the shelf steel box lintel rather than a concrete lintel if the joists are bearing directly onto it. I always feel the thin concrete lintels are better with a bit of masonry on top.

Standard 70mm x 100mm Conc' lintels have to have masonry on top. They only work in composite.

 

[cdbe]

Standard 70mm x 100mm Conc' lintels have to have masonry on top. They only work in composite.

I know that, but I believe there are some who disagree.

 

[noseall]

there are some who disagree.

Irrelevant. 70mm x 100mm PCC lintels have always had that prerequisite. 1 course of block or 3 courses of brick or some such. Direct point loads is a no-no.