Repointing old Victorian garden walls

[LewB]

Hello Good People,

It's been a while to ask a question, but I do read the forums and see lots of help for things which has been very useful.

I've made a pdf of photos to view
http://www.thepenvro.com/Private/Wallfilepdf.pdf

But I can't find an answer to this one. It involves repointing old 8 foot Victorian garden walls. Our terrace is made up of 5 story houses built in 1857. Most are of course broken into flats. We live in the ground floor of ours with the garden and own the basement as well. It's time this job was tackled. The two walls each side seem to be made of of different aggegates. One wall has red and other gray. What are these materials called? I get so many different answers from everyone!

Before I looked at the top of the gray wall, I thought I'd only be repointing the red one with a 3:1 Hybrid using 1 part crushed limestone, 1 part sharp sand, 1 part soft sand & 1 part lime putty. Not purchased yet....found this at
http://www.ecolime.co.uk/?cn=lime-mortar.php
and viewed the video on repointing a stone wall.

I then bought a Pointmaster (vs the trigger gun used in the video.) It looked less fiddly and I will have to be on a ladder over the basement courtyard section.
http://www.pointmaster.co.uk/index.html

I emailed another supplier who promptly told me I cannot use a gun, they do not work at all. They said I need NHL. So am now very confused.com Which to use? The Ecolime mortar product looks easier to use with the Pointmaster to me per the video. It looks like the right product for this old wall.

OK , then I made the mistake of looking at the gray wall on the other side which isn't so bad on the wall surface, but the top of that wall has been splitting apart! I don't often get on the ladder to view the top of that wall, but wanted to clear out the weeds that grow on top and found sapling trees growing out of it in early spring!

Deceased neighbour previously had cut down trees in her garden that shed leaves and made compost that worked into the top between the bricks...no capstones are in place. Sometime along the way she had mortar poured in but that must have been on top of some of the soil as I can lift some if it out and have tried to pull out roots of ivy and whatever. I've cut and killed off the stumps of the two saplings in early spring and they've not regenerated. Only the ivy seems to keep coming back. I think she did one a dozen years ago, maybe about the same time the mortar was filled. I can only dig down so far to get the dirt out. I've re-dosed with masses of root and stump killer and am pulling out all what I think are ivy roots...but will reach a point where I can go any deeper.

How best to fill? With some crumbling bits of stone and mortar for a bed, then fill with mortar? The new owner is a school who bought the flat for their chaplain and this is not going to be a priority for them, so am not going to bother, will just fix the top and my side. Up to them to sort their side.

OK will stop now... any help appreciated. This will obviously take quite a bit of time and plan to do some soon and then leave until next spring. The men in my house have other jobs to go to, so home improvements fall to me.

Lew

 

[joe-90]

They look like they've been pointed with sharp sand to me. That's what I'd use. Not too strong a mix - about 5 sand to 1 cement. Forget about pointing guns and stuff you'll need a bag or two for that lot.

 

[LewB]

They look like they've been pointed with sharp sand to me. That's what I'd use. Not too strong a mix - about 5 sand to 1 cement. Forget about pointing guns and stuff you'll need a bag or two for that lot.

Hi Joe, Thanks for the response. I was told I must not use cement as the stone in place is old/porous and needs lime mortar so the water can get out .
Lew

 

[peaps]

They look like they've been pointed with sharp sand to me. That's what I'd use. Not too strong a mix - about 5 sand to 1 cement. Forget about pointing guns and stuff you'll need a bag or two for that lot.

Hi Joe, Thanks for the response. I was told I must not use cement as the stone in place is old/porous and needs lime mortar so the water can get out .
Lew

Yes you need lime mortar for this job but you need a sharp sand, almost grit. These old bricks will not stand cement because it's too strong andwill damage them, you also need the flexibility of the lime and breathability. Same for the stone as it's mainly made up of it.


I would go for NHL 5 to do the job as it's outside and exposed but this also depends on the condition of the bricks and stone but I think 5 is the way to go. Don't get pre mixed it's a ripoff, mix it up your self..

 

[cotswoldbuilders]

It looks like the pointing thats been done is a sand/cement mix, normally the mix doesnt want to be stronger than the stone, but would have thought a 6 sand 1 cement and 1 lime would be ok.
Tradlime do ready mixed lime for repointing in large tubs, about £12 plus vat.
I would fit a coping along the top of the wall, there must be a lot of water getting in there.
Sodium Chlorate is a good weed/ stump killer, and although banned from retail, you can get it via Fleabay.

 

[LewB]

Yes you need lime mortar for this job but you need a sharp sand, almost grit. These old bricks will not stand cement because it's too strong andwill damage them, you also need the flexibility of the lime and breathability. Same for the stone as it's mainly made up of it.

I would go for NHL 5 to do the job as it's outside and exposed but this also depends on the condition of the bricks and stone but I think 5 is the way to go. Don't get pre mixed it's a ripoff, mix it up your self..

Thanks Peaps, that's what I was thinking but am worried the grit will be too big so thought of 3.5, I don't want fine but I'd like it to go through the pointmaster. What size is medium grit in mm?

 

[LewB]

It looks like the pointing thats been done is a sand/cement mix, normally the mix doesnt want to be stronger than the stone, but would have thought a 6 sand 1 cement and 1 lime would be ok.
Tradlime do ready mixed lime for repointing in large tubs, about £12 plus vat.
I would fit a coping along the top of the wall, there must be a lot of water getting in there.
Sodium Chlorate is a good weed/ stump killer, and although banned from retail, you can get it via Fleabay.

Is this the product? Cheltenham is closer to me that a lot of the other places as the carriage is dear. http://www.traditionallime.co.uk/LimeProducts/PremixedDryMortar/tabid/179/Default.aspx

Thanks for the tip on Sodium Chlorate, been using a lot of retail stuff which works but is very expensive. There are no children or pets near these walls... hope it won't poison the birds!

EDIT: Yes, coping on there. Now that could be done with almost anything flat? Does it have to be coping stones or can I use something lighter for me to lift up there, slate or similar, something the colour of brick? Do I use mortar or use cemement since the idea is to keep the water off the top altogether? Thanks again