There are now so many different solar panels that it is confusing as to which ones will last the longest. Does anyone have experience with solar pv and what do they think about it. How long really will these panels last in practical terms. I understand that solar pv roof tiles last longer; any comments anyone on the above.
Solar Energy photo voltaic panels
- Thread starter gardener1214388
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I might be mistaken, but in our climate at least, the panels tend to degenerate before they've been able to pay for themselves. Looking at the cost per unit of energy generated, you start to see just how economical it is to generate power at a station and distribute it via a grid! Again, I could be wrong, but I think you'd be better off putting your money into an ISA or other "high-interest" account.
I don't know whether the situation has changed in the past two years: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...truth-They-dont-work-time-100-YEARS-pay-.html
I don't know whether the situation has changed in the past two years: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...truth-They-dont-work-time-100-YEARS-pay-.html
I work as a solar panel installer. Most solar panels will have performance guarantees as to how well they will perform over time. My recommendation would be to pick a well known manufacturer who is likely to still be around to back their guarantee in 25 years.
Having said that the vast majority of panels will be manufactured to the similar standards (In the UK they should be MCS certified) but some panels have better performance attributes than others.
Oh and as for the pay back toolbeltdandy is simply incorrect and as the Daily Mail article is about solar water heating panels not solar PV although its still wrong about them as well.
If I owned a house and had the money I would have solar PV panels installed on my house without hesitation as they are one of the best pretty much guaranteed investments out there (8-11% return on investments)
Having said that the vast majority of panels will be manufactured to the similar standards (In the UK they should be MCS certified) but some panels have better performance attributes than others.
Oh and as for the pay back toolbeltdandy is simply incorrect and as the Daily Mail article is about solar water heating panels not solar PV although its still wrong about them as well.
If I owned a house and had the money I would have solar PV panels installed on my house without hesitation as they are one of the best pretty much guaranteed investments out there (8-11% return on investments)
J
joinerjohn
Peter, the only reason Solar PV gives your stated return on investment is due to the unrealistic subsidies (which we pay for directly through our electricity bills.) The only people making money out of the solar pv scheme is you installers and the manufacturers. If the subsidies were removed completely, hardly anyone would bother having it installed in the first place.
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Maybe i'm missing something with these panels.
In a post above in states 8-11% return on investment, (forget about the subsidies etc) is it really an investment.
If I was to "invest" £100,000 on solar panels what would their value be after 25 years, I would get a 10% return but loose my initial investment money. Where as if i purchased a house for a £100,000 i could rent it out to get some return each year and hopefully in 25 years time still have a house to sell
Or am i missing something ? ?
In a post above in states 8-11% return on investment, (forget about the subsidies etc) is it really an investment.
If I was to "invest" £100,000 on solar panels what would their value be after 25 years, I would get a 10% return but loose my initial investment money. Where as if i purchased a house for a £100,000 i could rent it out to get some return each year and hopefully in 25 years time still have a house to sell
Or am i missing something ? ?
If you spent £100,000 on solar panels then you would be buying a hell of a lot of them.
For a more realistic domestic figure we recently installed 3.5kWp of panels (14 panels) for £8 350. The customer should get income or electricity savings of over £32k over 25 years with the income being increased by RPI each year.
For a more realistic domestic figure we recently installed 3.5kWp of panels (14 panels) for £8 350. The customer should get income or electricity savings of over £32k over 25 years with the income being increased by RPI each year.
J
joinerjohn
But surely that's only because of the totally unrealistic subsidies people with solar PV panels are getting? At the end of the day, it's a big con. Without the subsidies you couldn't possibly achieve anything like £32k savings in a hundred years.
What's particularly galling is the fact that it's the rest of us, without these miracle panels who are paying the price of subsidising them, through our own electricity bills.
Of course that is currently the case. The whole point of the feed in tariff scheme is to encourage people to invest their money in renewable energy to 'pump prime' the market. In 2 years the FIT rate has more than halved but the returns are fairly similar to the levels they were at the start due to massive reductions in the costs of panels over that time period because the market in solar panels has expanded worldwide (due to feed in tariff schemes) meaning there are now large economies of scale. With electricity prices increasing and panel prices dropping hopefully in the future there will be no need for FIT subsidies so long as a fair price is paid for electricity produce and fed into the grid by people who have PV panels installed.
J
joinerjohn
So, you agree with me that the FIT's are (in my words) totally unrealistic. As someone else has pointed out, the original investment is negated because in the future, you can't sell the secondhand panels on (they're essentially scrap after x amount of years)
I still say it's totally unfair to people, who can't afford, or have these panels fitted (because of the orientation of their roofs) to subsidise the people who can afford, or have them fitted. The government should look again at FIT's and ban them. Leaving it up to power companies to perhaps give some of their vast profits back to these people. I maintain that it's a con to keep the rich , even richer, and the poor even poorer.
I still say it's totally unfair to people, who can't afford, or have these panels fitted (because of the orientation of their roofs) to subsidise the people who can afford, or have them fitted. The government should look again at FIT's and ban them. Leaving it up to power companies to perhaps give some of their vast profits back to these people. I maintain that it's a con to keep the rich , even richer, and the poor even poorer.
No I don't agree the FITs are totally unrealistic they add a tiny amount to people bills (and of course this is only because the power companies pass on the cost rather than taking it out of their profits) the increase to bills because of FITS in negligible when compared tot he increases due to rising gas prices and if we don;t encourage renewables with scheme like FITS then in the future we will be paying vast sums for electricity generated from expensive fossil fuels and/or nuclear
J
joinerjohn
So would you care to state how much this Tiny cost is to us consumers? Explain why it's a good thing for me and others to subsidise such a scheme? Would it not be better for the energy companies to fully subsidise such a scheme themselves( given that they make huge profits)
I only ask, because my electricity bills are certainly at least 25-30% bigger than they were a few years ago, yet I still only use the same amount. Are you telling me that it's realistic of me to expect to pay these increases so the few can reduce their energy consumption (and profit at the same time)?
Your electricity bills are so much higher only in a small part due to FITs the vast majority of this rise is due to increased gas prices (gas being the main fuel used for power stations in the UK) and other fossil fuel costs. The benefit of the FITs scheme even for those not having a renewable source of energy (such as solar panels) installed themselves is the long term reduction in reliance on fossil fuel to supply our electricity hopefully meaning in the future large rises in the gas prices will be mitigated more than now (diversity of supply)
Ultimately there are finite amount of fossil fuels and North Sea oil and gas are starting to run out so we are coming to the end of cheap energy in the UK and I expect energy prices to carry on rising at the current rate unless we do things to reduce our reliance on fossil fuels.
I would have loved the government to have set the FIT scheme up so that power companies had to fund it themselves by reducing their profits slightly but the fact is we have no real way of controlling the profits they make (Ofgem is crap) so they would have just passed this cost on any way.
Ultimately there are finite amount of fossil fuels and North Sea oil and gas are starting to run out so we are coming to the end of cheap energy in the UK and I expect energy prices to carry on rising at the current rate unless we do things to reduce our reliance on fossil fuels.
I would have loved the government to have set the FIT scheme up so that power companies had to fund it themselves by reducing their profits slightly but the fact is we have no real way of controlling the profits they make (Ofgem is crap) so they would have just passed this cost on any way.
I don't think it really matters what panels you put on your roof now, as most people will change them for better performing panels long before the old ones are finished, as technology in that field is moving fast.
Solar panels 42p per kw IIRC
5p-11p per KW for gas/coal ?
Funny definition of expensive.
Shale gas means we have another hundred years supply, at least.
I get the idea of giving solar a kickstart with FITs, I am unconvinced it will ever come down in price enough to be competitive with, well, anything.
And I really don't see the need to push it now, but rather wait another 10-20 years when it will be even cheaper, and the technology even more efficient.
Cart before the horse, or whatever saying is appropriate here.
Rates for electricity from Solar PV are going down rapidly (halved in 2 years) while rates for Electricity from gas are going up quickly. At some point there will be a crossover when renewables become cheaper than electricty from gas but if we don't invest in renewables now then that will never happen and we will be stuck paying for gas regardless of the price
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