Storage heater not wired on Economy 7?

[jayc]

Hi,

I've just move dinto a new house and the previous owners always complained about very high electricity bills. Well I think I've worked out why but how do i change it?

It has electric hot air heating with a central storage heater. Now my understaning is that it should charge at night on the cheap rate energy and discharge this during the day.

The wiring in the house has been up dated and there is an added CU with the lights, sockets, shower etc wired though it but its not a split load type. The is 2 seperate fuse boxes with the main power feed for the storage heater and one for the cooker.

Now the storage heater has a small diameter cable coming from it as well as the larger main feed. I assume the smaller cable activates an internal relay allowing the storage unit to be charged. I also assume that the smaller diameter cable should be powered on a split load board and only be powered at night on the eco 7 package?

Thing is its not. Its wired to a 32amp RCD in the CU which is powered 24/7 as its the ring main for all the sockets and therefore the heater is sucking juice 24/7.

Whats my next action to get this changed? I'm informing my energy supplier today of the move and I guess I need to ensure I'm on an eco 7 package.

I've not even had a chance to look at the meter yet so it may well be that it doesn't even have a eco 7 meter fitted so I guess thats down to the supplier to arrange for that but will they just change the meter and leave the tails for myself or an electrian to terminate into a box for the storage heater and also for an immersion heater? Or will they wire it though to the CU?

Sorry if the explaination sounds a bit dodgy, I have a better than average knowledge of electrics but i'm no sparks so I might well be wrong on some aspects.

 

[Adam_151]

Do you own a digital camara? ...

 

[bernardgreen]

Now the storage heater has a small diameter cable coming from it as well as the larger main feed. I assume the smaller cable activates an internal relay allowing the storage unit to be charged. I also assume that the smaller diameter cable should be powered on a split load board and only be powered at night on the eco 7 package?

You may have the type of heater that was designed to be controlled via a timer. This was designed to provide off peak heating with out the need to wire in additional consumer units. Installing this type of heater meant only the meter had to be changed and the heaters wired to convenient spurs added to existing wiring for the heavy load current and to a timer module for the control supply.

IF that is the case ( you need to check that with the makers handbook )then any timer that can be set to the times of your economy rate will do. Has the advantage on very cold days of being able to boost it albeit on the normal tariff.


Bernard
Sharnbrook

 

[jayc]

I have a digi camera so I'll take some pics tonight.

The heater is only a few years old and I have the manual, well some of it but I'm sure it states in there that it should be wired on an eco 7 feed to charge only when the cheaper rate is in effect. There's certainly no external timer only temp control, fan switch and manual override button allowing it to charge during the day in an emergency (I've checked and this is switched off!)

 

[jayc]

A little update.

Can't find the digi camera, must be in a box as I've just moved!

The storage heater is a Dimplex Electricaire unit. And according to the manual it should be wired to only charge when the eco 7 is switched via the meter. Currently its switched via the ring main which all my sockets are on so it charges 24/7 or does it?

I'm now thinking that the main power feed for it must be on the second meter which only gets power during the eco 7 period therefore it doesn't matter how its switched as it can only be connected to the supply when the meter is powered right? But this model of heater has the option of day energy boost so it must have a normal rate feed or else how do it charge during the day?

I have 2 seperate meters, not the nice modern dual rate meter. Am I right in thinking only the devices connected to the low rate meter are using the eco 7 tariff? Everything else is charge at normal rate?

I'm a bit confused and I'm about to work away for a few weeks so I won't get a chance to look at it properly till I'm back which is a bummer.

 

[jayc]

Ok the update has beena long time coming due to working abroad but I eventually found the problem.

The previous owner had a cowboy jack of all trades guy in to fit a power shower just after they moved in, well this donkey had bridged the E7 circuit with the ring main supplying power to the 13A sockets in the loft. God know how or why but there was a junction box on the ring main spurring off to a FCU for the shower but also connected to this was another 2.5mm cable that led to the immesion heater.

Basically the E7 circuit was then powered 24/7 and the storage heater/immersion where being powered all day long so where they saved £100 or so from not getting a proper sparks in they lost out £6k or so over the past 3years as their leccy bill was £250 a month! Ours was been £52 a month since we moved in

We are still finding little horrors from this cowboys work cropping up now and then!

 

[Lectrician]

Often the central storage heaters also have a smaller feed for a fan/controls which is on the peak tarrif.

The off peak load will be switched by the meter.

These heaters are typically around 12kw, and even used during off peak are not cheap to run.

You should be able to tell from your lecky bill, or that of the previous occupier if it is wired correctly not.

 

[ColJack]

the smaller cable is most likey to be the fans and a "top up" heater if the stored heat runs out or wasn't switched on the night before a sudden cold snap..

 

[Steve]

Why didn't the original owners ever sort it out?! I'd be a little worried about shelling out £250 a month on electric! I mean, were they multi millionnaires? And didn't they think it odd when their lights used to go dim when the element cycled on and off?

 

[Lectrician]

Why didn't the original owners ever sort it out?! I'd be a little worried about shelling out £250 a month on electric! I mean, were they multi millionnaires? And didn't they think it odd when their lights used to go dim when the element cycled on and off?

Maybe there was nothing to sort, other than installing a more efficient system. Is sounds like it is wired correctly to me.

 

[jayc]

There was something to sort and its now sorted, My leccy bills are approx 1/5th of theirs so this proves it. Ok so i run my washing machine, tumble drier and any othe power hunrgy devices during the eco7 period when they never so thats helps too.

Yes the lights did dim and you could here the relay clunk every time the storage heater cycled.Sso when tis happened at 3pm I new there was a problem but not being a spark thats why it took me a while to trouble shoot.

The previous owners where friends and they had the shower fitted when they moved in so they just assumed £250 a month was about right for ellecy heating having never had it before. Especially how everyone goes on about how expensive and inefficient it is.

For those who have suggested the cables it turns out the smaller was the control for the thermostat and the switched live to control when it charged. This was the wire that was getting 240V 24/7 and keeping it charging, its only meant to be at 240V during the eco7 period. The larger cable went straight to a 60A fuse box which was live 24/7 and not switched by the meter. (i'm lucky and have only 1 meter and time switch so everything used during the eco7 period is charged at low rate).

The moral of the story is as most of you well know, cowboy tradesmen don't save you money!