Taking a layer of bricks off a wall - am I mad?

[joneian]

Hi All,

This is my first post on the forum, but it has been a useful resource for me so thank you.

I'm in the middle of having an extension built. My house is 1930's and has flemish bond (not cavity) walls. With the new extension, the old external wall is now internal, and upstairs where it supported the tile roof, it now supports nothing. One of the new rooms in the extension has turned out to seem very small indeed.

I'm sure this is quite a mad suggestion, but I was wondering if it would be possible to remove one of the layers of the two layers thick wall, to make the room 4 or 5 inches bigger. I appreciate that this would be a pain in the arse job, and having to cut the header bricks in half will be a very dusty job.

Here's a picture of the wall in question

Untitled

• joneian
• 19 Jan 2009
• 2

At the top you can see the front row of bricks is missing, and where you can see blue painted pebbledash is the full width of the wall.

Any thoughts or advice? Is the house going to fall down if I do this? Is it going to be far too much hard work for the extra few inches?

Many thanks,
Ian

 

[h2o]

that is some REAL trouble for 100/120 mm extra room. you say the wall now supports nothing above? are you sure? if it was the out side wall supporting the roof/trimmer joist then it sounds like the upstairs part of the wall has been taken out? if so then its because you've had a room made bigger upstairs, if so then the new floor joists would prob db tied in or resting over the wall you wish to thin in which case the room above would become un safe

 

[joneian]

Hi,
Thanks for your reply.

Let me clarify - the wall in the picture is upstairs, above the celing is just the loft. I am not contemplating thinning the wall downstairs which as you say supports the floor joists for upstairs.

The gap above the blue pebble dash, is where the fascia/guttering used to be. Bricks have not been removed as part of the work.

Cheers,
Ian

 

[h2o]

Oh ok I see now must of been too late for me last night, then there is no tec reason not to thin the wall as long as the ceiling joists don't sit on any part of the inner wall. even then it would be just a case of being a little careful. still i hope you don't mind brick dust in yr coffee though

 

[gday2uk]

What are you going to do with an extra 4"?

 

[^woody^]

There may be an issue with slender ratios if the roof is bearing onto the wall.

As it is flemish bond, then the wall will be hard to physically reduce, and the resulting strength of a quarter-bonded wall will be less than if it was stretcher-bond. I suppose it would be possible, but you'd need it looked at properly by someone suitable, to see if extra bracing is required

Can't you alter the new external wall to reduce its thickness to gain extra space? And then chop the render off the existing wall to gain a bit too?

One thing would be to form a recess by only blocking up the window on the internal side of that wall, or widening the existing part of the window to create an appearance of more space, and form a feature of it

 

[chappers]

if it really isn't supporting anything then why not take it down completely and re configure the two rooms

 

[gday2uk]

if it really isn't supporting anything then why not take it down completely and re configure the two rooms

There's someone with a thinking cap on!
You could even put double doors in if you wanted to have open plan but also the option to close it off.

 

[^woody^]

Its supporting the roof isn't it, there is a wall plate there

I take it that the OP means that the external half of the wall is not supporting anything

 

[^woody^]

BTW, the plasterboard is fitted incorrectly - it has not been cross bonded with staggered joints

And does the longest side of the boards span the joists?

 

[joneian]

Hi All,

Thanks for your comments.

gday2uk:

What are you going to do with an extra 4"?

I know it doesn't sound like much, but given how small the room is, it would increase the volume by 50% But really, at the moment I can't fit a standard bath across my bathroom. (I know, I know, I should put the bath on the other wall, or find a smaller bath...)

^woody^:

...the resulting strength of a quarter-bonded wall will be less...

Good point - I hadn't thought that the resulting wall would be weaker than a stretcher bond wall.

Can't you alter the new external wall..

Unfortunately, I can't alter the new external wall as its as close to the property boundary as the planning officer will allow.

And then chop the render off...

Will definitely chop off the render as it comes off quite easily.

One thing would be to form a recess...

I like the idea of making the window a recess, I'll do that as well - Thanks!

Its supporting the roof isn't it, there is a wall plate there

The wall plate is where the roof rafters used to end. The rafters have all been ripped out, and the roof now extends over the room in question. The wall plate is the only thing the wall is now supporting...

chappers:

...why not take it down completely...

That is a good idea, unfortunately the stair well is the other side of the wall.

Thanks a lot for your thoughts guys. I think I'll go with the simpler suggestion of chopping off the render, and forming an enlarged recess from the window, and getting a smaller bath. I recon that will feel a little bit larger but not weaken the wall or not fill my coffee with brick dust

Cheers,
Ian

 

[AndrewSchofield]

chappers:

...why not take it down completely...

That is a good idea, unfortunately the stair well is the other side of the wall.

Ian

Can you not knock down the brick wall and rebuild a thinner stud wall in the same place - then it wont affect your stairwell but you'll have a bit of extra space in your bathroom. Or even re-build in a single skin brick wall if you prefer? - must be easier than splitting two brick skins that are tied together?

 

[joneian]

Can you not knock down the brick wall and rebuild a thinner stud wall in the same place...

Now that is a good idea. It would certainly be a darn sight easier. I'll look into this - many thanks!

Cheers,
Ian

 

[AndrewSchofield]

Like others have said you need to be 100% certain the wall isn't still supporting your ceiling or something otherwise you could end up in a mess! If it is you would probably be able to put in a UB or even a timber beam (check with Sturct. eng.) to provide the support and build your new stud wall beneath this. Seems like a lot of work for little gain but if it makes the world of difference to your bathroom and there's nothing else you'd rather be doing then why not?

 

[masona]

BTW, the plasterboard is fitted incorrectly - it has not been cross bonded with staggered joints

Me think, not enough screws either