Unvented / Vented / Combi warmfront boiler replacement

[leftnothing]

Hi,

I have a Potterton Prima F50 boiler (SEDBUK Group G) which intermittently fails to ignite the main burner and just stays with the pilot light lit resulting in no hot water/heating sometimes in the mornings.

I have just been informed that I qualify for a Warmfront grant, an assessor has not yet been around but I thought it wise to do some research beforehand so I am prepared! - As SWMBO wants a better shower performance , I was looking at different options and someone has suggested that replacing my boiler with a “System Boiler” unvented with mains pressure could be a good option?

I’ve just read a number of threads on this site regarding Warmfront and Ideal boilers (so I won’t be touching them! ) and I will push for something better, possibly a Vaillant ecoTEC Plus 615/618? (are they okay?)

I have a 4 bed, 1 bathroom (bath/shower/wc/basin) + 1 en-suite (shower/wc/basin), kitchen, utility and D/S WC property. The CH system is vented with a 117l cylinder in the airing cupboard and two header tanks in the loft, 2 x two port valves (allowing independent HW and CH) and pump. I replaced the standard room thermostat with a Danfoss TP7000 programmable one a few years ago, I’ve 11 rad’s but none have TRVs.

We are looking for a replacement that is economical to run, gives a good shower performance, as we have two young boys must be capable of handling ‘family use’ i.e. Washing machine / dishwasher being used during the day, baths for the kids and showers for parents in the morning.

I guess my questions are:

1) Is it a lot of work to change from a vented to unvented system plumbing wise? (the header tanks are located directly above the cylinder in the loft, the boiler is located on the wall in utility room)

2) Is a Warmfront grant (£3,500) likely to cover the costs for changing to a unvented system and do their rules allow it? (are they more efficient?)

3) Alternatively should I consider a high kWH combi boiler i.e. Vaillant ecoTEC Plus 837 with has a flow rate of 15.2 l/m

With a budget of £3500, what would you suggest is my best option for a replacement boiler/CH system?

LN.

 

[doitall]

I think you may have misunderstood the purpose of a warmfront grant.

 

[leftnothing]

I think you may have misunderstood the purpose of a warmfront grant.

Why? - I am only trying to make the best choice for the replacement of a faulty Group G boiler - Is that not allowed under the rules of the grant?

It's possible the boiler could be repaired (under the grant) but that won't make it any more efficient... (The boiler is included under the scrapage scheme as it's Group G, so I assumed that it would be eligible for replacement under the Warmfront grant!?)

LN

 

[PEDANTICVINDICTIVEMAN]

Think you will get what you are given being as taxpayers are paying for it,
you may possibly get something decent ie Vailliant, or a pile of crap like a Ravenheat.

 

[heatingman]

down this end of world the wf grant will only replace what you have, ie std wall mounted for "a" rated wall mounted, unlagged vented cylinder for lagged vented cylinder. If client wishes to have anything done out of this re-mit they have to pay any differences/improvement costs.

 

[leftnothing]

Think you will get what you are given being as taxpayers are paying for it,
you may possibly get something decent ie Vailliant, or a pile of crap like a Ravenheat.

I understand there may be challenges getting what I want from Eaga under a warmfront grant, however, the question I first need an answer to is, what do I need/want!? i.e. Post #1

Any help with this would be most appreciated!?

LN

 

[leftnothing]

down this end of world the wf grant will only replace what you have, ie std wall mounted for "a" rated wall mounted, unlagged vented cylinder for lagged vented cylinder. If client wishes to have anything done out of this re-mit they have to pay any differences/improvement costs.

Thanks for the info Heatingman! - Would the fitting of TRV's be included for energy efficency gains under the grant? (if replacing the boiler for "a rated" condensing one of the same type)

LN

 

[heatingman]

yes, trv's, roomstats, converting to fully pumped, rad that are leaking etc. Its treated as an up-grade grant as appossed to an improvement grant. But you never know you might be lucky or have different guidelines up there.

 

[Slugbabydotcom]

Think you will get what you are given being as taxpayers are paying for it,
you may possibly get something decent ie Vailliant, or a pile of crap like a Ravenheat.

I for one would be well happy to see Ravenheats fitted on warmfront grants.

They only got a bad name because divvy diyers fitted them on unflushed systems full of crud which would knock any boiler for six.

If you want a real crap boiler ask for an Ideal Isar

 

[transam]

Think you will get what you are given being as taxpayers are paying for it,
you may possibly get something decent ie Vailliant, or a pile of crap like a Ravenheat.

I for one would be well happy to see Ravenheats fitted on warmfront grants.

They only got a bad name because divvy diyers fitted them on unflushed systems full of crud which would knock any boiler for six.

If you want a real crap boiler ask for an Ideal Isar

Ravenheat CSI condensing system inovation ??the world's only atmospheriic A rated condensing boiler , absolute turkey badly dcesigned ill thought out , lousy company to deal with waste of space , there imfamous tacky ally secondary heat exc that slowly dissolve's away , there tacky condensate connection to the back of the boiler with what looks like a hep2o elbow with 1 nut missing banged onto the back technical dept is a joke literally ( Ideal never used them ! nor shall I be )

 

[onlyfitidealboilers]

Hi,

I have a Potterton Prima F50 boiler (SEDBUK Group G) which intermittently fails to ignite the main burner and just stays with the pilot light lit resulting in no hot water/heating sometimes in the mornings.

I have just been informed that I qualify for a Warmfront grant, an assessor has not yet been around but I thought it wise to do some research beforehand so I am prepared! - As SWMBO wants a better shower performance , I was looking at different options and someone has suggested that replacing my boiler with a “System Boiler” unvented with mains pressure could be a good option?

I’ve just read a number of threads on this site regarding Warmfront and Ideal boilers (so I won’t be touching them! ) and I will push for something better, possibly a Vaillant ecoTEC Plus 615/618? (are they okay?)

I have a 4 bed, 1 bathroom (bath/shower/wc/basin) + 1 en-suite (shower/wc/basin), kitchen, utility and D/S WC property. The CH system is vented with a 117l cylinder in the airing cupboard and two header tanks in the loft, 2 x two port valves (allowing independent HW and CH) and pump. I replaced the standard room thermostat with a Danfoss TP7000 programmable one a few years ago, I’ve 11 rad’s but none have TRVs.

We are looking for a replacement that is economical to run, gives a good shower performance, as we have two young boys must be capable of handling ‘family use’ i.e. Washing machine / dishwasher being used during the day, baths for the kids and showers for parents in the morning.

I guess my questions are:

1) Is it a lot of work to change from a vented to unvented system plumbing wise? (the header tanks are located directly above the cylinder in the loft, the boiler is located on the wall in utility room)

2) Is a Warmfront grant (£3,500) likely to cover the costs for changing to a unvented system and do their rules allow it? (are they more efficient?)

3) Alternatively should I consider a high kWH combi boiler i.e. Vaillant ecoTEC Plus 837 with has a flow rate of 15.2 l/m

With a budget of £3500, what would you suggest is my best option for a replacement boiler/CH system?

LN.

you will get what ur givin an be happy with that!

 

[leftnothing]

I for one would be well happy to see Ravenheats fitted on warmfront grants.

They only got a bad name because divvy diyers fitted them on unflushed systems full of crud which would knock any boiler for six.

If you want a real crap boiler ask for an Ideal Isar

The WF assessor has now visited and he's agreed on a Vaillant ecoTEC 418 boiler, new honeywell 2-port valves, programmer and RF thermostat.

He said that TRV's are only included in the grant if installing new rad's, so I'm going to fit some British Gas branded Invensys TRV4's myself before the new boiler is fitted.

In order to provide more control and efficiency, I am thinking of purchasing the new Vaillant VRT 392 control (along with the VR65) to fit instead of the Honeywell room stat / programmer supplied under the grant. Has anyone used one of these? Are they easy to operate? (My current Danfoss TP7000 is great on features but terrible to operate, very unintuitive)

Vaillant have said I could re-use my existing cables for the eBUS and also confirmed I could fit the VR10 to my normal cylinder (as long as it's secured well), however would this work correctly in the 'real world'? The wiring is approx 15 years old and currently has 230v going through it connected to the TP7000 stat.

I've traced and mapped out my current wiring with Visio (it's S-Plan (ish)) and also created a wiring diagram for an VR65/eBUS installation (using the same wires). If you were the WF installer, would you fit the Vaillant controls (supplied by myself) with very little work involved or insist on fitting the Honeywell one's? I'm confident enough to do the actual re-wiring and fitting of the controls myself (either before or after installation of the boiler)... the learning curve would be how to setup the controls if done afterwards. Is it straightforward?

Any thoughts or advice appreciated!

LN

 

[Agile]

He said that TRV's are only included in the grant if installing new rad's, so I'm going to fit some British Gas branded TRV4's myself before the new boiler is fitted.

LN

You seem to be very lucky to have had a good boiler and valve specified ! Perhaps you live out of the range of their usual owned contractors.

Where are you getting BG branded TRV4s ?

Tony

 

[leftnothing]

He said that TRV's are only included in the grant if installing new rad's, so I'm going to fit some British Gas branded TRV4's myself before the new boiler is fitted.

LN

You seem to be very lucky to have had a good boiler and valve specified ! Perhaps you live out of the range of their usual owned contractors.

Where are you getting BG branded TRV4s ?

Tony

The assessor was a good guy and was honest with me on what he could / couldn't do. After reading up on here and doing my homework, I knew roughly what I wanted so just asked for it!

I had originally picked out the Drayton TRV4's, I know someone who works at BG so can purchase the BG branded one's significantly cheaper!

LN

 

[Agile]

That the first time that I have heard of BG engineers being able to buy BG branded equipment!

Can any BG staff confirm that is the case?