Vokera Linea 28 - Code 1

[ThisIsNowTakenToo]

Hi all,

First things first, what I know about boilers could fit on a very small postage stamp, so please keep that in mind if/when replying!

I noticed earlier today that there was no hot water, and when I checked the boiler (see subject) I could see there was a fault (see subject). So, I dug the service manual out, brushed off the dust, and looked up the code. Apparently, code 1 is an ignition failure. I guess the clue was in the lack of burning gas!

There is some fault finding flow charts in the service manual, so I followed those, and it suggested replacing the ignition control, or if that's okay, the PCB. (clearly I have no idea whether the ignition control is okay - how to test ignition controls is not on my very small postage stamp)

There was also some other info about common causes of code 1, where it suggested that you check the gas supply (who would have guessed that air doesn't ignite as well), and that the polarity of the electrics is right (I get the feeling that the author of the service manual has watched far too many star trek episodes - reverse the polarity captain!).

Anyway, to cut a long story short, after following the flow charts etc, I did what any self-respecting software engineer would do, and google'd it. That's how I found myself here. So, after reading a few messages, I decided to restart the boiler a few times (using MS Windows does teach you something!), and to my amazement, it actually fired-up!

So, in case you're wondering why I'm boring you with my ramblings, the reason is that I'm wondering whether it is currently working more by luck than design, and hence whether it is worth getting someone to look at it. (we pay someone an annual fee for a service and breakdown scheme, which covers parts and labour, in case that effects your answer)

Oh, in case it is relevant, it has been unusually hot here recently. (a comment in one of the earlier messages mentioned that hot weather can cause this problem to occur - I think it said about sticky gas valves?)

Thanks

James

 

[Agile]

Well Googled!

You have a sticky gas valve. They only stick when the weather is hot and mostly first thing in the morning. Repeated relighting every THREE minutes will often eventually get them to relight.

The only long term solution is to get a CORGI engineer to replace and set up the gas valve.

Sometimes when the weather gets cooler they dont stick until the next summer. One of our clients was very amused when I explained this to him last summer and managed to wait until this year before getting it changed. We charge £221 inclusive.

The problem is caused by glycol antifreeze put into the gas pipes by TRANSCO.

Tony

 

[doitall]

The problem is caused by glycol antifreeze put into the gas pipes by TRANSCO.

Tony

Are you sure thats not the National Grid

 

[ThisIsNowTakenToo]

Hi Tony,

Thanks for the reply. The same problem happened again earlier on, so I switched it on and off a couple of times, and it then fired-up okay again.

After the above happened, I called the engineer that services it etc, and had a nice conversation with his answerphone. I'm hoping he has a lie-in on Sunday, as I know I do! (it would be just my luck for him to wake me up!)

Oh, I noticed that you emphasised every THREE minutes, which I took to mean that I shouldn't do it too frequently as it may cause other problems?

Cheers

James

PS - A quick Google shows that the gas valve costs about £70-£75. Does that seem like a reasonable price? (part no was 1836, which was replaced by 10021021, which was replaced by 10025074, as far as I can tell)

 

[Agile]

I emphasise that for your safety!

I have seen a boiler that exploded and pushed the unregistered installer UP the stairs!

If the lack of ignition was caused by a lack of spark or the right mixture and the gas valve was opening then its possible for the mixture to build up in the boiler and cause an explosion.

Only attempting ignition every three minutes allows unburnt gas to disperse and reduce the chance of an explosion!

Tony

 

[ThisIsNowTakenToo]

Thanks for the warning, Tony. I'll make a mental note of that one.

Do you have any comments on the question about the gas valve price? (I may have edited my original message, whilst you were replying to it)

Thanks

James

 

[Agile]

Yes, I do!

It seems that you may be doing the consumer trick of minimising prices when it suits them of conveniently forgetting the VAT.

My Google came up with £87.50 probably plus several pounds for carriage!

But I must stress the need for the valve to be set up when its installed.

You dont just fit a new gas valve and turn it on!

Tony

 

[ThisIsNowTakenToo]

Thanks for the reply, Tony.

Yes, you're right, it was £70-£75 excluding VAT/P&P. I guess I'm too used to buying stuff from Play etc where VAT/P&P is always included these days...

I appreciate it requires proper fitting etc, I was just curious what the part actually costs, as the rest is just paying for someone's expertise/time.

Note: It should all be covered by the breakdown scheme we pay for anyway, but I like to know these things, as it is usually worthwhile not being clueless about these things, otherwise you never know if you get the whole truth...

Cheers

James

 

[Paul Barker]

Not long ago I had to change a mixer tap for a real old gentleman. There was a moneygrabing younger wife (sat on his shoulders like a vulture waiting for him to die) in the next room listening in, he said how much will that be? I said well the tap could be £30 to £40. From next door in a stern school ma'm voice "they don't cost that much".

If it weren't for the fact he was a vulnerable old man I'd have walked out. For his sake I carried on and did the job.

This consumer attitude we are trying to sneak some extra money out of them is tyresome.

How many times do we handle faulty products but we can't get our money back, how about the cost of capital invested in stock, the contribution to overheads everything should make. WHY ON EARTH SHOULD OUR PRICE BE EXACTLY THE SAME AS THE BEST PRICE YOU CAN FIND ON GOOGLE you ungrateful so and so.

 

[ChrisR]

Selected Product: 478173
Description VOKR 10025074 GAS VALVE
Retail Price
(Excluding VAT ) £125.07

The part has to be identified, ordered, carriage paid, received/fetched from the courier (some get "lost in transit")and the paperwork done, or it has to be ordered, and collected from the shop - which may take an hour.
If it's in stock that money is already out, and storage has to be provided. On receipt it has to be checked for completeness. The installer effectively has to guarantee the part, and it's very difficult to return a part which is faulty.

I don't do any of that for nothing, and wouldn't expect any properly run business to do so.

If a customer has a part ready when I need it, OK I'll install it, at his risk. Some firms wouldn't dream of doing that.

 

[Paul Barker]

Exactly Chris, and the Summer trafic along Seamer Road is what I have to embark on to go and pick up a part from Parts Cente.

I love it when customer supplies the part or the tap or the bath or whatever, then when there is something wrong with it, which invariably there is, it's their problem not mine. And like you say when there is some waiting in to be done so you can get the part from the courier they have to do so. We have some courier firms delivering here whose depot is in York. So that's half a days labour to collect the part of I'm out when they try to deliver.

No mate you do a google search for it get it to your door and let me know when I can come and fit it. I'd be a very happy bunny if all my customers would do that.

 

[ThisIsNowTakenToo]

Hi Chris/Paul,

Unfortunately, there are some companies (big, small, and everywhere inbetween) that will charge you whatever they can get away with, and often the reality is that what they can get away with depends on how much/little you know about what you're paying for.

Just in recent weeks, I saved 20% on my car insurance, 30% on a mobile, and 15% on an MP3 player, simply because I knew I could get a better deal elsewhere, and when I told the company they cut a chunk off their price. So, the sad reality is, it is the way of the world these days.

Note: The price that Chris quoted for the gas valve sounds like a perfect example of this sort of thing to me, as that's a fair way over £70-£75.

Of course, you are both right when you say that we pay for quality service too, and I happily pay that bit more for companies that are worth it, e.g. MoreComputers, Play, SVG etc, and avoid companies that are not worth the trouble whatever the price, e.g. Eclipse, Savastore etc.

So, I guess all I'm saying really is that knowing a reasonable ball-park price allows you to judge whether you're dealing with someone where it's worth haggling, or someone that is charging an honest price for their services. (in this line of work, for me at least, that would include the hassle/time of getting any replacement parts that are required)

Note: In this particular case, it is all irrelevant anyway, as it should be covered by the annual breakdown scheme, so knowing the price is more about curiosity than anything else. (curiosity skilled the cat)

Anyway, my apologies if my comment implied that every company is the same, as there are many honest companies out there, unfortunately just like in many other areas of life, it is the few that spoil it for the rest.

Cheers

James

 

[doitall]

Interesting comment re you're service contract.

Are you sure it includes the parts as well, normally they are chargable.

 

[Agile]

Note: The price that Chris quoted for the gas valve sounds like a perfect example of this sort of thing to me, as that's a fair way over £70-£75.

Cheers

James

There you go again James! It is NOT £70-£75 !!!!


When you add VAT and carriage its £92.50.

You are as guilty of cheating on this topic regarding the price by posting misleading and incorrect information.

As Chris has explained, there are costs and overheads involved in running any business and these have to be met in the charges to customers.

We are transparent and always quote our prices in advance so the customer can choose where to go.

Tony

 

[ThisIsNowTakenToo]

doitall, according to the info about the breakdown scheme, it is all included.

Tony, I quoted the £70-£75 price in this case, as Chris' price of £125 said it was excluding VAT, so I assumed (rightly or wrongly) it excluded P&P too.