Wiring a 3 gang 2 way switch

[gardener1214388]

I have a three gang 2 way light switch plate with 3 core and earth and two core and earth fed into the box.
I have a single gang 2 way switch with 3 core and earth fed into the box for the chandelier and wall light.
On the 3 gang 2 way light switch:
I want to use one switch for a chandelier and wall light with the single gang light switch mentioned earlier.
I want to use another switch for an independant single light.
I want to use another switch for an independant single light.
In other words: the 3 gang light switch must operate a chandelier with wall light and two independant other lights.
Any ideas on how to wire the switchplate.

 

[Taylortwocities]

Are these lights, and the switch, existing ones - or are they new?

Can we have a photo of the back of the switch.

 

[ban-all-sheds]

Any ideas on how to wire the switchplate.

All the ideas you need are here: //www.diynot.com/wiki/electrics:lighting

 

[gardener1214388]

Are these lights, and the switch, existing ones - or are they new?

Can we have a photo of the back of the switch.

Photos of switch plates.
View media item 42021

 

[riveralt]

I have a three gang 2 way light switch plate with 3 core and earth and two core and earth fed into the box.

Which operates what at the moment?

I have a single gang 2 way switch with 3 core and earth fed into the box for the chandelier and wall light.

Does this single gang two way link to the 3 gang 2 way - Ah yes I have seen you description on the photos now?

On the 3 gang 2 way light switch:
I want to use one switch for a chandelier and wall light with the single gang light switch mentioned earlier.

Thus replacing the single switch and making it a one way switch?

I want to use another switch for an independant single light.
I want to use another switch for an independant single light.

How do you intend to connect the cables from the independant lights to this three gang switch?

Any ideas on how to wire the switchplate.

Yes but you need to be clear what you have already in place first.

 

[gardener1214388]

I have a three gang 2 way light switch plate with 3 core and earth and two core and earth fed into the box.

Which operates what at the moment?

I have a single gang 2 way switch with 3 core and earth fed into the box for the chandelier and wall light.

Does this single gang two way link to the 3 gang 2 way - Ah yes I have seen you description on the photos now?

On the 3 gang 2 way light switch:
I want to use one switch for a chandelier and wall light with the single gang light switch mentioned earlier.

Thus replacing the single switch and making it a one way switch?

I want to use another switch for an independant single light.
I want to use another switch for an independant single light.

How do you intend to connect the cables from the independant lights to this three gang switch?

Any ideas on how to wire the switchplate.

Yes but you need to be clear what you have already in place first.

That's the problem; a previouse "qualified" electrician made a mess of the wiring; although it all worked OK. He had used a six terminal junction box with several external choc blocs incorporated in the jbox wiring; it was frankly/ spaghetti junction with numerous cables; some old wiring and some single red and black cables; how it all worked; unable to trace it all. I normally note/ make drawings of any plug, circuit, jbox, switch before altering anything; in this case; it was a nightmare, so I am left with the cables in the roof all connected; as noted in the photos; to the 3 gang and single gang switches; chandelier and two separate single lights. What I would like to know is how do I connect all of this to junction box wiring circuit to make it all work. Normally I have no problem wiring; but this is a definate head scratcher.

 

[gardener1214388]

I have a three gang 2 way light switch plate with 3 core and earth and two core and earth fed into the box.

Which operates what at the moment?

I have a single gang 2 way switch with 3 core and earth fed into the box for the chandelier and wall light.

Does this single gang two way link to the 3 gang 2 way - Ah yes I have seen you description on the photos now?

On the 3 gang 2 way light switch:
I want to use one switch for a chandelier and wall light with the single gang light switch mentioned earlier.

Thus replacing the single switch and making it a one way switch?

I want to use another switch for an independant single light.
I want to use another switch for an independant single light.

How do you intend to connect the cables from the independant lights to this three gang switch?

Any ideas on how to wire the switchplate.

Yes but you need to be clear what you have already in place first.

That's the problem; a previouse "qualified" electrician made a mess of the wiring; although it all worked OK. He had used a six terminal junction box with several external choc blocs incorporated in the jbox wiring; it was frankly/ spaghetti junction with numerous cables; some old wiring and some single red and black cables; how it all worked; unable to trace it all. I normally note/ make drawings of any plug, circuit, jbox, switch before altering anything; in this case; it was a nightmare, so I am left with the cables in the roof all connected; as noted in the photos; to the 3 gang and single gang switches; chandelier and two separate single lights. What I would like to know is how do I connect all of this to junction box wiring circuit to make it all work. Normally I have no problem wiring; but this is a definate head scratcher.

Meant so say: so I am left with the cables in the roof all UN-connected; 3core and earth to single gang 2 way switch; three core and earth to one of the 3 gang two way switches, 2 core to the 3 gang switch and chandelier, wall light, single light and another single light. What I need to do is to have as before; 2 way chandelier and wall light switching, but one way switching to the other two individual lights; hope this makes sense.

Read more: //www.diynot.com/forums/electrics/wiring-a-3-gang-2-way-switch.309079/#2272015#ixzz1kUnZkm6w

 

[riveralt]

The problem I see from the photographs you have supplied is that the three core and two core and earth cables (in the three gang switch) are not connected to the terminals in the way I would expect for a two way circuit. Hence as you suspect the wiring through the junction box has been mixed up.
I'm afraid you may have to go back to the beginning and trace the cables that come into the three gang switch back to the their point of origin.

Split the process into two stages dealing first with the chandellier and wall lights and focus on the three gang switch wires.
At the three gang switch identify the three core cable. This will be red/blue/yellow and earth. Under normal circumstances these cables would act as 'strappers' and provide the two way link between the chandellier/wall light switch in the three gang and the single gang. Pick one of the switches on the three gang as your chandellier switch. You would put the red in the Common, the blue (with red sleeve) in L1 and the yellow (with red sleeve) in L2 on both switches.
Identify the two core cable. This should be red/black but from the photographs it could be red/red. You need to identify which on these two cores is live and which one is switch live (the one that goes to the live at the lights). Once you have identified which is which the live goes into L1 on the three gang chandellier switch and the switch live goes to L2 on the same switch.
This should enable the two way switches to operate as required.

To get the other two switches on the three gang to operate as normal switches you would have to run two twin and earth cables from their respective live power sources to Common on the second and third switch and their respective switch lives back to their lights.

There is another way to do this by linking the commons in the three gang switches to give a permanent live to switch 2 & 3 then run switch lives back to the appropirate ceiling rose light.

You can see how difficult this is to explain from afar - especially if there is a junction box in the way and the wiring is less than normal.
You could do with a multi-meter to establish which cable is live and switch but you would need to understand how to operate one.

If all this appears too daunting then I would suggest you get an electrician in to try and sort out the mess.

 

[gardener1214388]

I have a three gang 2 way light switch plate with 3 core and earth and two core and earth fed into the box.

Which operates what at the moment?

I have a single gang 2 way switch with 3 core and earth fed into the box for the chandelier and wall light.

Does this single gang two way link to the 3 gang 2 way - Ah yes I have seen you description on the photos now?

On the 3 gang 2 way light switch:
I want to use one switch for a chandelier and wall light with the single gang light switch mentioned earlier.

Thus replacing the single switch and making it a one way switch?

I want to use another switch for an independant single light.
I want to use another switch for an independant single light.

How do you intend to connect the cables from the independant lights to this three gang switch?

Any ideas on how to wire the switchplate.

Yes but you need to be clear what you have already in place first.

That's the problem; a previouse "qualified" electrician made a mess of the wiring; although it all worked OK. He had used a six terminal junction box with several external choc blocs incorporated in the jbox wiring; it was frankly/ spaghetti junction with numerous cables; some old wiring and some single red and black cables; how it all worked; unable to trace it all. I normally note/ make drawings of any plug, circuit, jbox, switch before altering anything; in this case; it was a nightmare, so I am left with the cables in the roof all connected; as noted in the photos; to the 3 gang and single gang switches; chandelier and two separate single lights. What I would like to know is how do I connect all of this to junction box wiring circuit to make it all work. Normally I have no problem wiring; but this is a definate head scratcher.

Meant so say: so I am left with the cables in the roof all UN-connected; 3core and earth to single gang 2 way switch; three core and earth to one of the 3 gang two way switches, 2 core to the 3 gang switch and chandelier, wall light, single light and another single light. What I need to do is to have as before; 2 way chandelier and wall light switching, but one way switching to the other two individual lights; hope this makes sense.

Read more: //www.diynot.com/forums/electr...-switch.309079/#2272015#ixzz1kUnZkm6w[/QUOTE]

Many Thanks for your valuable feedback and advice.

 

[Taylortwocities]

You mean that you have disconnected everything at the junction box? Oh dear.

I can see what he has done and why.
He has used the original standard two way circuit cabling that went to a one gang switch (red/black 2 core&earth and the red/yellow/blue 3-core& earth)
to enable the separate switching for the two wall lights.

He has done this to avoid the need to chase more cables into the wall.

I could tell you how it was wired and how it could be rewired (not much different to before but it would take an hour of typing) and you still might not get it.

All of the cables will come together at the junction box together with a live&neutral lighting feed.

To sort all of this out you will need a multimeter and the knowledge of how to use it. Do you have both of these attributes?

 

[SUNRAY]

Are these lights, and the switch, existing ones - or are they new?

Can we have a photo of the back of the switch.

Photos of switch plates.
View media item 42021

How many cables and how many red & black singles do you have?

I think it started as something like this
View media item 42043//media.diynot.com/125000_124249_42043_33253874_thumb.jpg
Does this compare with the number of cables you have?
If not, 'POWER TO OTHER ROOMS' may not exist or there may be more than one
OR the chandelier + wall light may be linked elsewhere.[/u]

edit: clarified wording

 

[SUNRAY]

The problem I see from the photographs you have supplied is that the three core and two core and earth cables (in the three gang switch) are not connected to the terminals in the way I would expect for a two way circuit. Hence as you suspect the wiring through the junction box has been mixed up.
I'm afraid you may have to go back to the beginning and trace the cables that come into the three gang switch back to the their point of origin.

Split the process into two stages dealing first with the chandellier and wall lights and focus on the three gang switch wires.
At the three gang switch identify the three core cable. This will be red/blue/yellow and earth. Under normal circumstances these cables would act as 'strappers' and provide the two way link between the chandellier/wall light switch in the three gang and the single gang. Pick one of the switches on the three gang as your chandellier switch. You would put the red in the Common, the blue (with red sleeve) in L1 and the yellow (with red sleeve) in L2 on both switches.
Identify the two core cable. This should be red/black but from the photographs it could be red/red. You need to identify which on these two cores is live and which one is switch live (the one that goes to the live at the lights). Once you have identified which is which the live goes into L1 on the three gang chandellier switch and the switch live goes to L2 on the same switch.
This should enable the two way switches to operate as required.

To get the other two switches on the three gang to operate as normal switches you would have to run two twin and earth cables from their respective live power sources to Common on the second and third switch and their respective switch lives back to their lights.

There is another way to do this by linking the commons in the three gang switches to give a permanent live to switch 2 & 3 then run switch lives back to the appropirate ceiling rose light.

You can see how difficult this is to explain from afar - especially if there is a junction box in the way and the wiring is less than normal.
You could do with a multi-meter to establish which cable is live and switch but you would need to understand how to operate one.

If all this appears too daunting then I would suggest you get an electrician in to try and sort out the mess.

A picture of the cables at JB area marked with what you have already identified would be good.


Sorry River I understand the direction you are ultimately heading (the same as me with the common live) the OP is trying to restore the system back to now it was originally working (common live). There is no need to run any new cables, I think what you are initially describing may confuse the OP more than he already is.

edit to clarify/improve wording

 

[gardener1214388]

The problem I see from the photographs you have supplied is that the three core and two core and earth cables (in the three gang switch) are not connected to the terminals in the way I would expect for a two way circuit. Hence as you suspect the wiring through the junction box has been mixed up.
I'm afraid you may have to go back to the beginning and trace the cables that come into the three gang switch back to the their point of origin.

Split the process into two stages dealing first with the chandellier and wall lights and focus on the three gang switch wires.
At the three gang switch identify the three core cable. This will be red/blue/yellow and earth. Under normal circumstances these cables would act as 'strappers' and provide the two way link between the chandellier/wall light switch in the three gang and the single gang. Pick one of the switches on the three gang as your chandellier switch. You would put the red in the Common, the blue (with red sleeve) in L1 and the yellow (with red sleeve) in L2 on both switches.
Identify the two core cable. This should be red/black but from the photographs it could be red/red. You need to identify which on these two cores is live and which one is switch live (the one that goes to the live at the lights). Once you have identified which is which the live goes into L1 on the three gang chandellier switch and the switch live goes to L2 on the same switch.
This should enable the two way switches to operate as required.

To get the other two switches on the three gang to operate as normal switches you would have to run two twin and earth cables from their respective live power sources to Common on the second and third switch and their respective switch lives back to their lights.

There is another way to do this by linking the commons in the three gang switches to give a permanent live to switch 2 & 3 then run switch lives back to the appropirate ceiling rose light.

You can see how difficult this is to explain from afar - especially if there is a junction box in the way and the wiring is less than normal.
You could do with a multi-meter to establish which cable is live and switch but you would need to understand how to operate one.

If all this appears too daunting then I would suggest you get an electrician in to try and sort out the mess.

A picture of the cables at JB area marked with what you have already identified would be good.


Sorry River I understand the direction you are ultimately heading (the same as me with the common live) the OP is trying to restore the system back to now it was originally working (common live). There is no need to run any new cables, I think what you are initially describing may confuse the OP more than he already is.

edit to clarify/improve wording

Thanks to all of you for your input........problem solved....discarded three gang switch, run new cables down under the plaster metal conduit; only just managed it; tight squeeze; fitted two gang switch; created new circuit in loft and all tested works a treat; should have done this in the first instance to save a lot of frustration. Problem solved