45m2 Patio laying

[chriselevate]

Brilliant, thanks for that r896neo.

As promised here we go (numbers are where the photos were taken from)....



The block paving (left hand side path) is not being re done this year. But he's going to grade it down onto the new lower patio. The right hand side path is going to be redone as he's included that in his quote. I'm not happy how the slabs are touching my house at the moment so the idea was to take 50% of the gap (currently with gravel in) and put it in between the new slabs and the house that way moving the slabs away from my house.

I really hope the picture help as I'm desperate for some input with this project and really want it doing right.

Measurements are approx 4m x 11m.

 

[r896neo]

There is absolutely no problem with paving butting against the house provided its at the correct level. It should always be 150mm below dpc level.

So if he falls the paving away from the house where will the water go? It looks like the right side in the first photo is a good bit lower so water can fall that direction but then it will just run off into your neighbours house.

This is the kind of stuff that should be detailed in a quote. In my opinion simply letting it run away down to the low side isn't great. I will say though its very hard to tell exact levels etc from photos so it may be suitable to just fall it down to that side, its just slightly concerning that this hasnt been discussed and agreed on already.

 

[chriselevate]

Ok so I had a few quote and they all ranged in cost. One guys suggested that the 150mm below DPC level wasn't an issue I my levels are fine at the moment. He was going to run an aco drain along the back of the house to deal with surface water.

Another guy said he's like to take it all lower (150mm below DPC) and run Aco drains along the back of the house.

The guy I've gone with said I could have aco drains but he said there wouldn't be an issue with the drainage so was happy to do the job with tilting the patio away from the house and having a gravel string round all sides. I've gone with this guys as his price seemed reasonable for the 3-4 weeks of work and he's been very open and honest about what he's doing. He discusses things and is happy to do what I want as the customer. Having said that it sounds like I should be doubting him now. I don't want to doubt him as he's more that willing to adapt plans as and when needed.

The first job he's got on his hands is breaking up that 1/3rd concrete base and digging up the 2/3's part of soil and filling 4-5 skips up.

We are on a hill so yes, I guess any fall will go towards my neighbour if not careful. I really don't know what to do now.

 

[r896neo]

I can only offer the advice I've given get some other opinions and take your choice.

There is a reason the aco drain quotes were more expensive and that's because its more work and in all likelihood they may have been more experienced pavers to know it needed drains.

You are living in dreamland if you think a couple of strips of gravel will absorb 45sqm of rain. Imagine all the downpipes on the rear of your roof relying on some gravel to remove the water discharged as your rear half of roof is probably only marginally more than your new patio area.

Perhaps the way the land falls will disapate the water naturally but if not you may have an angry neighbour wondering why his garden is now flooding. This is the sort of thing you can only get a feel for being on site and with experience.

The belt and braces approach is to install drainage at this point and be sure its sorted. If you dont you risk the simple run off method being inadequate as installing drainage after the patio will be much more expensive and require some of it to be relaid.

 

[chriselevate]

Thanks, I know what you mean. When I said I went with the guy I've gone with, he wasn't the cheapest or the most expensive. The most expensive had a quote that was huge. I've tried to do the best I can but don't know what else I can do. Thanks for your advice though. I guess there's not a lot more I can do.

When you say "install drainage rather than risk simple run off" I'm not sure what so of thing you are meaning. Is this referring to aco drains?

 

[r896neo]

Yes either falling to a gulley or more likely aco drains. I have seen bigger patios simple fall onto a lawn and disperse but water will not simply fall onto the lawn if 95% of your lawn is uphill. If you lay the paving with a fall away from the house and also falling toward the low corner it will help but in heavy rain you will create a small stream accelerating toward your neighbour which is not very fair although many many people do it.

 

[chriselevate]

Perfect, thanks for that r896neo. So I need to think of it like using a hose pipe to wash my patio... where will the run off go? It has to go somewhere and I don't want our nice neighbour to become an angry neighbour once their garden is flooding with our run off.

So, looking at photo 1, you can see the drain pipe in the middle of the house. I'm guessing these will currently go under my patio and into my garden to soak aways? Isn't there a rule that you can't send surface water into the mains drainage or something?

So when the builder looked at it he said that as we are dropping the patio it'll expose this drain and he'll see how much fall is on it and where it goes to. I liked this as no one else had thought about it or factored it in. He's very keen on drains so I'm sure that if I add in aco drains he won't have any object or issues with doing it. How would it would sound having an aco drain running along the end of the patio with a fall into the centre in order to place this water into the same place that that back roof goes? I'm just trying to consider some options at the moment and come to some decision/plans about what can be done.

Thanks again for the input.

 

[r896neo]

The aco placement can be decided on by the paver who will decided where he is falling the paving and some input from you as to your aesthetic preference.

a full 11m run of acos is a bit unnecessary but its hard to make it look good if you do a partial line of them.

You can not drain surface water into foul drains but you can t into your rainwater gully as that will go to a soakaway or a storm water system.

Again just to be clear i'm not saying you must have acos, just that with a patio that size i would always recommend it and in your case it looks like a good idea to avoid sending a good quantitiy of run off into your neighbour and having puddles where the paving joins the lawn.

If your paver is confident its not needed and you trust him then as he is physically on site and able to see the lie of the land his opinion is worth listening too.

 

[chriselevate]

Thanks for getting back to me r896neo. I have just been reviewing the paperwork, surveys and response form the seller in anticipation of your response. It looks like soakaways were never totally identified and I have a horrible feeling that on the rear of the property they probably build the extension over where original soakaways were and have dealt with all the surface water by draining them into the foul drains.

If this is the case, then now would be as good a time as any to resolve this issue as I'm guessing it is currently not acceptable what is in place if my suspicions are correct. what is your take on this?

Once this is decided then it needs deciding where the fall is going, fit some new soakaways and then send the roof and patio surface water into the new soakaways. It is worth noting that our soil is extremely sandy so this is our favour in terms of fitting soakaways.