Am I allowed to do this ?

[aceuk]

Hi
Can someone tell me if I’m allowed to do this electrical work myself?
I am going to convert the garage. It already has 3 sockets connected to the ring main and a central light.
The thing is that the sockets are up high (around 5’) so I need to lower them.
Simple tasks just change the socket into a junction and extend the cables.
I know that they need to be in conduit and not lower than 450mm from the floor.
Also there will be a separate WC created so I would need to add a ceiling rose and switch plus an extractor.
Can I tee into the ring main for this or does it have to be a lighting circuit.

Thanx

 

[ericmark]

I see nothing in what you say that would require LABC to be notified. The lights can be run from ring main if a fused connection unit (FCU) is used but one must consider the problems should the power trip.
All new work must follow new regulations i.e. RCD on all sockets under 20 amp but the Part M regulation on heights is not strictly adhered to where it can be shown there is good reason not to. i.e. all other sockets already mounted at different height.
If no opening window in a loo I think Part F controls size and running of fan. Where there is light from a window then using light switch to control fan may not be accepted.

 

[ColJack]

not electrically, but the drain connections for the WC might..

 

[ban-all-sheds]

Hi
Can someone tell me if I’m allowed to do this electrical work myself?

You are if you can do it safely.

Simple tasks just change the socket into a junction and extend the cables.

Try to replace the cables instead.

I know that they need to be in conduit

Why do you think they do, and what sort of conduit?

and not lower than 450mm from the floor.

That depends. You really should study the Building Regulations.

Will you end up with cables concealed in the walls? Do you know what the Wiring Regulations say about that?

Also there will be a separate WC created

Which implies a water supply. If the garage is detached and you have a TN-C-S (aka PME) supply (see //www.diynot.com/wiki/electrics:earthing-arrangements) this may mean decisions to be made on whether to export the PME earth or make the garage a TT installation.

See http://www.theiet.org/publishing/wiring-regulations/mag/2005/16-elect-inst-outdoors.cfm?type=pdf

 

[ban-all-sheds]

I see nothing in what you say that would require LABC to be notified.

I can see two things:

The conversion of the garage to habitable space and the installation of a WC.

Planning permission may also be required.

 

[aceuk]

Thanx for all replies.
Ericmark - Is the fused connection unit a must .If so setup would be like this :-
FCU – live to pull cord switch and then on to ceiling rose.
Or a switchable FCU – are you allowed one in a WC.
When you say RCD on all sockets under 20 amp I take it you mean at the consumer unit.
As for the height of sockets are you saying I can have them at the same height as the others in the house ( about 8” above floor)

ColJack - not sure what you mean – I have a soil pipe right next to the wall where the WC is going so connecting to that should not be a big problem.
ban-all-sheds – I have rewired a couple of houses that I had so I’m confident in my work.
Replacing the cables really isn’t an option. There is an extension above the garage and the flooring is T&D chipboard .The ceiling in the garage is 2 layers of plasterboard so access to the wire between the joists is very difficult.
As for it having to be in conduit I read somewhere that it was part of the regs is this not the case.
Yes I will end up with cables concealed in the walls.
Planning permission is required.
Just really wanted to sort out the electrics at the moment.

 

[Chri5]

The 450mm height is for new builds and fully strip refurbs and doesn't have to apply to you, so the choice is 100% yours. Matching the height to elsewhere in the property is normal.

The sockets are part of a ring, So I'd expect some cables can be replaced to avoid joints, which unless crimp or solder MUST be accessible.

You won't want nasty aesthetics of blank face plates above the socket positions so I'd suggest you pull all the cables back, end up with the 2 cables (ring in ring out) from the point they enter the room (garage) and extend to the new positions.

As for rcd, unless you can either have cable greater than 50mm from finished wall surface or intend to use metal conduit or special metal sheath cable, then rcd protection must be supplied for the circuit.

As for the lighting, I'm not sure because you don't make it clear if the existing is via a light circuit or simply taken from the existing socket circuit in the room (garage).

Best to have the lighting on a seperate circuit. If that is impossible then via a 3a or 5a fused spur from the ring circuit.

 

[flameport]

I have rewired a couple of houses that I had so I’m confident in my work

In that case, why all this:

... Is the fused connection unit a must
... Or a switchable FCU – are you allowed one in a WC.
... When you say RCD on all sockets under 20 amp I take it you mean at the consumer unit.
... As for the height of sockets are you saying I can have them at the same height as the others in the house
... ColJack - not sure what you mean –
... As for it having to be in conduit I read somewhere that it was part of the regs is this not the case.

The work you are intending to do is notifiable. Notification must be done BEFORE any work starts, so you can't just 'sort out the electrics' as you intended.

Planning permission and building regulations are completely different things.

For the original questions:
- You can do this work yourself, provided it is notified first and you are competent to do the work.
- You cannot use junction boxes unless these will be accessible for future use. Hiding them in the walls or ceiling is not acceptable.

There is far more involved here than you appear to realise.

 

[aceuk]

I suppose the best thing to do would be to cut back the in/out cables (going to exsisting sockets) and fit them to a junction box then cut a hole in the ceiling and push it up. From the junction box I could run a spur socket (only requiring one cable)
I have a RCD in the fuse box
Cables will be behind plasterboard that will be dot & dab fix.
So will it need conduit or not.
The exsisting lighting looks like they have taken it from the socket circuit

 

[flameport]

I suppose the best thing to do would be to cut back the in/out cables (going to exsisting sockets) and fit them to a junction box then cut a hole in the ceiling and push it up.

That is possibly the worst thing that could be done.
Not compliant with BS7671.

 

[aceuk]

flameport - the regs have changed alot .
The last time I did work was around 25 years ago.
I know Planning permission and building regulations are completely different things I was just responing to a question.

For the original questions:
- You can do this work yourself, provided it is notified first and you are competent to do the work.
This is what I was trying to find out .A competent person is someone that is registered or not.
There is a certain amount of work that is allowed to be carried out by the householder.I was just wondering if I can do this work without it have to be checked or notified to anyone.

- You cannot use junction boxes unless these will be accessible for future use. Hiding them in the walls or ceiling is not acceptable
I see but if I put them in the ceiling and the is a floor above that is OK.

 

[aceuk]

Flameport - I'm sorry I do not see the problem.
If I lifted up my floorboards and the was a junction box there why could I not run a spur cable to a socket.
It's the same thing.

 

[flameport]

The problems are:
Regulation 526.3 requires that connections such as junction boxes are accessible for future testing and maintenance.
Concealing them under a floor is NOT accessible.

526.6 'there shall be no appreciable mechanical strain on the connections of conductors'.
Shoving a junction box into a ceiling void will mean the box is supported by the cables, which will rather obviously put mechanical strain on the connections.

Removing sockets from a ring circuit and replacing these with spurs fed via junction boxes is poor design, and also completely unnecessary.

 

[ban-all-sheds]

I have rewired a couple of houses.