Am i within 'the law'
- Thread starter gno750
- Start date
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Cheers westie, I only browsed over the thread so missed that.
I don't see too much of a problem, providing the flex used is suitable for the environment.
Well, I did ask
I'm sure you understand that non-residential locations might open up various other cans of worms!Kind Regards, John.
Do you not see a problem (at least, in terms of regs, even if one would probably have to wait a few lifetimes to see a consequent incident) in a 0.75mm² cable protected by a 13A fuse?
Kind Regards, John.
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Now there is a problem!
But did the units come pre-fitted with flex and what do the MI state?
The OP has indicated that the light tracks come fitted with 0.75mm² cable and that, where necessary, he extends with cable of the same size (we haven't {yet} asked him how he makes the join!). When there is also a heater he uses a 13A fuse, so there is clearly a theoretical problem of cable protection if he combines lighting and heater cables together.
I don't think what the MI says will make any difference. If they suggested that 13A protection was OK for the fitted 0.75mm² cable, I think BS7671 would over-ride that
Kind Regards, John.
So what i glean from this thread is that the way i have been installing my awnings, lighting & heaters doesnt not conform entirely to regulations.
But the use of a fcu with respective fusing at the point were i normally use an ordinary jb would cure the problem in respect of safety in regards to protecting the lighting cable (& the awning cable as well as it 1.0mm 3 core)?
But the use of a fcu with respective fusing at the point were i normally use an ordinary jb would cure the problem in respect of safety in regards to protecting the lighting cable (& the awning cable as well as it 1.0mm 3 core)?
gno
Yes
John
That was my original point, why does BS7671 have to be involved as long as the installation is safe?
As it is pretty non-standard I doubt 7671 would be of any use (apart to scheme members that have no choice)
Yes
John
That was my original point, why does BS7671 have to be involved as long as the installation is safe?
As it is pretty non-standard I doubt 7671 would be of any use (apart to scheme members that have no choice)
Yes, that's how it seems.
At least partially. Any cable less than 1.25mm² needs to be protected by a fuse smaller than 13A (i.e. 3A or 5A) - so awning and lighting would come from the load side of an FCU and the heater from the 'input' side of the FCU (the side connected via a cable to the plug/socket).
As I said before, one theoretical problem would be strain relief for the cables - since an FCU is normally only designed to have (at most) one flex secured by a cable clamp. If you weren't using conduit, then you could use stuffing glands or clip the cable outside of the FCU for strain relief, but I'm not sure what the solution would be if you used conduit.
Kind Regards, John.
There are several issues being discussed here, so I'm not sure which one you refer to. As far as cable protection is concerned, even if one forgets about BS7671, I don't think that a 0.75mm² or 1mm² cable protected by a 13A fuse would be considered 'safe' (e.g. by part P, which always applies - in dwellings), whatever we may think of the chances of it ever coming to harm!
Kind Regards, John
Cable in conduit, into a flex outlet (i.e, in reverse) link to FCU (unswitched) using the flex outlet to feed lights/awning, a further flex out let to heater.
Adds a bit to cost but does f=give the option of strain relief on all cables.
(though I'm sure there is/was a surface box at one time that included strain relief)
Adds a bit to cost but does f=give the option of strain relief on all cables.
(though I'm sure there is/was a surface box at one time that included strain relief)
Yes.
But so what?
Your very first word shows that the appliances are fixed, so whether the cable is considered fixed or not becomes utterly irrelevant - Part P applies to "electrical installations" which are etc etc, and the definition of "electrical installation" is (with my emphasis) "fixed electrical cables or fixed electrical equipment located on the consumer’s side of the electricity supply meter".
So Part P applies.
In the OP's situation, he has fixed appliances and fixed accessories (the junction box).
But as for the rest of the 3 pointless pages of back-and-forth, why don't you all do the simple thing, and read Schedule 4 and see if you can find any match for the installation of new powered awnings and new heaters which makes them non-notifiable?
It doesn't.
But I challenge anyone other than an experienced electrical engineer to know that what he'd done was reasonably safe if he didn't use BS 7671 (or an equivalent).
Very little of the 3 pages has actually been about notifiability. Most of it has related to whether or not the OP's long-standing practices are fully compliant with regulations (e.g. BS7671) and/or legislation (e.g. Part P) - and I think we can agree that, at least in some cases, they are not.
Kind Regards, John.
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