Boiler advice and acceptable Q's to ask the boiler installer

[Rsian]

Hi guys,

I'm hoping if someone can please advise?

Spec:
3 bed semi
1 bathroom (we only ever use power shower (salamander pump))
2 d/s rads
4 u/s rads
Mains output is fairly low
'Generally', only use one hot water source at a time
Cold water tank, and small (c/h?) tank in loft.
4" loft insulation, filled cavity walls

My current boiler (a perfectly working Myson Apollo), is located on an inside wall in the kitchen, with I think a flue going upstairs and out through the roof.

Due to a prospective new kitchen in a few months, I think it is a (begrudgingly), good opportunity to replace the boiler and move it into the airing cupboard upstairs, as we will most likely knock the kitchen through.

Q. We are not tight for space in the loft and don't ever intend to try and turn it into a liveable space- is it best to stick with a regular boiler, or is there any advantage changing to a system boiler?

Q. The airing cupboard is on an outside wall, but as the flue is going into the loft, should the connecting up work be minimal as any flue extension can just be connected to the existing flue?

Q. Is it appropriate for me to request to see the what I am being charged for the boiler alone, and if I am able to source an identical one cheaper, is it acceptable for me to supply said boiler?

Q. I'm on a tight budget, so any recommendations on good spec boilers would be appreciated.

Sorry for the long post, I hope someone is prepared to answer some of the questions, and thank you in advance!



Also, ballpark figures for this (I'm in the South East)?

 

[Tibbot]

You can't use any part of the existing flue. If your budget is so tight as to make you consider dangerous bodge methods, then you're best advised not to change anything.

 

[Rsian]

You can't use any part of the existing flue. If your budget is so tight as to make you consider dangerous bodge methods, then you're best advised not to change anything.

Hi, thanks for the response.

Budget isn't so tight so as not be able to afford extra flue, just trying to figure out what I can expect to be quoted for.

I assumed (incorrectly it would appear), that if there is an existing segmented metal flue extension weaving up from the kitchen out through the roof, then this is something which could be considered to be reusable!

If it's not, then it's not!

 

[Tibbot]

OP- You can ask whatever to whoever you like. If I were approached with phrases such as 'having a new kitchen', 'begrudgingly', 'reuse existing flue', 'buy boiler myself' etc... My advice would be the same. If you don't want to buy, don't buy.

 

[Rsian]

OP- You can ask whatever to whoever you like. If I were approached with phrases such as 'having a new kitchen', 'begrudgingly', 'reuse existing flue', 'buy boiler myself' etc... My advice would be the same. If you don't want to buy, don't buy.

Thank you, very helpful.

 

[Dan Robinson]

They certainly are the questions that would make me run a mile.

 

[Mark Br]

It's hard to answer your questions without a visit.

Ask friends and family for details of recommended installers and invite them to quote.

Personally I wouldn't entertain installing a boiler that I hadn't supplied. When (sorry, not if in the lifetime of a boiler) it goes wrong, you would expect me to attend, if I hadn't supplied it then I would charge for this. False economy in my view to buy it yourself considering the pittance I make on the boiler. And when I order a boiler I know I'm ordering all the right parts to go with it.

Also, customers that ask about this can send out the wrong message to decent installers. Presumably you want a good job, not a cheap job. The two don't go hand in hand.

If I am asked to quote for an install and the customer is giving signals that they are trying to save money warning bells would ring. To save me wasting my and your time I would tell you I wouldn't be quoting as I was pretty sure my quote would be too high. Most wouldn't tell you this, you'd then be wandering why so many have come to quote but only the guy that turned up on a white horse has bothered to quote

The above is meant as helpful info, not putting your intentions down.

 

[Tibbot]

Thank you, very helpful.

You chose the question about approaching people in the trade, but don't take my reply. Phone some installers (even British Gas & the like), tell them you begrudgingly might spend some money with them. Then mention you're on a tight budget so have an idea to reuse the old flue and supply your own boiler because you need to cut costs to help fund a new kitchen.

 

[OwainDIYer]

Q. The airing cupboard is on an outside wall, but as the flue is going into the loft, should the connecting up work be minimal as any flue extension can just be connected to the existing flue?

Probably simpler and cheaper to go straight through the outside wall. Flue extensions can be silly prices.

Get the fitter to supply the boiler. Even if you can get it cheaper, if you buy it yourself you then have arguments between your boiler supplier and your boiler fitter blaming the other in the event of a fault.

Be aware a new boiler may require upgrading existing controls and hot water cylinder to comply with Part L energy efficiency regulations.

 

[D_Hailsham]

Be aware a new boiler may require upgrading existing controls and hot water cylinder to comply with Part L energy efficiency regulations.

Really?

The only compulsory requirement is to fit a "boiler interlock", e.g. a thermostat and timer. The HW cylinder does not have to be replaced and upgrading from gravity HW cylinder to fully pumped is only listed as "good practice". (The boiler manufacturer may insist on fully pumped, but that's a different matter. In any case that can be done without replacing the cylinder.)

 

[Dan Robinson]

Do you know any gravity compatible boilers on the market?

 

[Bunnyman]

The Google warriors gone quiet now dan

 

[Dan Robinson]

D's alright....... Apart from his fixation on the Whole House Heatloss website


Far better than the like of JohnD and Nobcorn.

Scary how "JohnD and Nobcorn" comes up as a phrase in my auto correct

 

[Dan Robinson]

Lots of fun to be had sealing a system up and fully pumping a cylinder with an annulus type heat exchanger rather than a coil.


Seen more than a few gravity coils go pop after a cleanse and boiler swap.


Thank Christ for T&Cs written by a lawyer rather than Google and the ODPM as was

 

[Rsian]

Well firstly, thank you to those of you who were able to reply without being condescending.

I have not had to replace a boiler before, and having browsed online and read many stories of people receiving quotes differing by (quite literally), thousands of pounds, I thought a valid way to see what was necessary was by posting some observations and gaining some feedback on where genuine costs are valid.

Tibbot - try holding a hot water bottle to your stomach in the fetal position, get rid of some of them cramps...it'll pass in a couple of days...until next month of course!