boiler flue in possible breach (moved from Trade Talk)

[Oneofmany]

Didn't expect such a great response, thanks lads.

First off, I didn't paint the place (I think a child did given its pink!), it's in a real state but I'm not asking for decorating advice.

Pics attached (one showing both flues, mine and theirs, the others showing my window etc), I think given what everyone is saying about the type of flue being used, is that the work is above board? But like I said from what I read my fan and window is too close. I have no clue if these pics will help.

Thanks for the input.

 

[Oneofmany]

I suspect you'll find the installation is correct, but that doesn't mean to say it's not causing you a nuisance, and environmental health department might be the best person to speak to - although the housing association have an obligation to get involved as well.

Your extractor fan pushes stale air out of your kitchen, so isn't an issue, and may even help push their exhaust gasses away from you're place - test this out - but if it pushes smells out, then fresh air is getting pulled back in from somewhere, so do you have a window open near where their flue is.

Unfortunately the kitchen can get up to 30+degrees c when not in use, and a lot hotter if using the oven so the window is opened when using the over/cooker. The window is beside their flue (as shown in the pics) but I don't know if this is an issue or not (either allowing the smell in or properly fitted). The fan is directly beside their flue. And obviously when the fan isn't in use its just and open vent allowing air flow in and out.

The borough I'm in is useless, the enviro team blame the housing association and the housing association say its environmental services that need to get involved. I'm going to go above and make an official complaint but it seems pretty extreme for something so simple. Either it's been fitted properly or it hasn't, it might not be my neighbour's fault.

My neighbour has def done work to their place that's altered the structure and is causing other problems but the housing association doesn't seem to care. Called planning at council too but they havent been exactly helpful either.

Thanks for the info on the smell, good to know.

 

[Oneofmany]

Its a plume diverter ensuring the flue gases are discharged a long way from the property.

That's what I think is being used (see pics), so it might be fitted correctly? Thanks.

 

[Doggit]

Bad advice, it's an opening into the building so it very much is an issue.

I think I'm possibly going to have to defer to you Sooey, but I suspect this might end up being an arguable point. Does the wind flap covering the extractor outlet technically make it an opening in the same say as an airbrick would be. If it is classed as an opening, then the flue should be a minimum of 300mm away from it, but I reckon it's the window being open that's the cause of the smell coming in, and when closed, the smells stop. I also think that because the flue exits onto a common walkway, it should be 2.1M high, as is the black one in the third pic.

 

[Oneofmany]

Have asked for this to be moved to plumbing forum.
You say their flue is 100 mm from your fan and 140 mm from your flue, both too close but where does that leave your flue from your fan?

It does have a cover that diverts the fumes and condensation away from the properties, horizontal to mine, over the balcony.

pics?

Just posted pics. Not sure if it helps because there's no perspective to the pics. Will have to take measurement to be 100% on distance between my flue and fan. My flue is beside my window too but on the other side from theirs. In the pics, there's is the one of the left.

Thanks for moving it to the correct section and your input.

 

[Oneofmany]

Bad advice, it's an opening into the building so it very much is an issue.

If it is classed as an opening, then the flue should be a minimum of 300mm away from it, but I reckon it's the window being open that's the cause of the smell coming in, and when closed, the smells stop.

Good points and thanks. Let's see what sooey says too.

Their airbrick is the other side of their flue. Which is def less than 300mm (you can see it in the pics). My window has to be opened when cooking though and the window has built in vents for air circulation. Even with the window closed air is coming in from outside though minimal and yes likely arguable.

Aren't these regs set up for a reason? I would think for health & safety? Never met a plumber who hasn't done a great job, I hope this flue thing won't be my first bad experience.

 

[Doggit]

It definitely look as though the installs suspect, both for you, and the neighbor, and it might be worth contacting Gas Safe register to check the jobs been done properly. Does the flue extend as far as yours does, as yours is closer than 300mm to your window as well; so I have to assume that the length of your black piping takes it far enough away to become legal. And as you're flat doesn't have problems when your boilers on, I reckon the wind blows from the neighbors side.

 

[DaleRCL]

I thought you said their flue was 140mm from yours. Did you mean 1400mm?

Essentially an extract fan is an opening in the fabric of the building so in my opinion it should be 300mm minimum to your neighbors flue.

As Doggit says, you could call Gas Safe to come out and comment on, but it looks as though your flue is too close to your window as well. Even though yours is fitted with a plume management kit, it still needs to be 300mm from any openings.

 

[sooey]

It doesn't look great, you don't show us how long that flue is but you said it was dripping condensate to the car park below (which is also wrong), so the terminal is well away from any openings.
If their boiler exhaust is coming back in to your kitchen it will be well diluted and no danger, but still a nuisance which you shouldn't have to put up with.
Get gas safe out by all means, it's free, see what they say.

 

[Agile]

Even though yours is fitted with a plume management kit, it still needs to be 300mm from any openings.

That is an interesting question.

Unless anything has changed there is a disagreement between Gas Safe over the permissible distance to openings from an inlet point of a plume management system like your black one.

Most makers think that 150 mm is adequate for the air intake point whereas Gas Safe used to take the view that it should be 300 mm like any standard flue terminal.

 

[Dan Robinson]

If a manufacturer says it is so, then gas safe can do diddly squat.

 

[shambolic]

We state if plume kit fitted then air intake terminal drops to 150mm

 

[Oneofmany]

Gas safety have said they won't come out to inspect, because I haven't made an official complaint about the company who installed either flue, which is reasonable. I wouldn't have a clue who installed either of them, mine was installed before I moved in and neighbour doesn't communicate. GS said they'd send a letter saying I complained, which is only going to cause more problems with neighbours who are anti-social.

I'll need to try another route, that isn't going to cause more problem for everyone. Would employing a plumber to come out and have a peak at the work be a good idea? Superficially at my neighbour's and throughout for me obviously. But if they find an issue, would they write up a report I could take to the housing association?

Honestly I can't afford loads to investigate something that is possibly not a problem, I might be stuck with this given GS can't do much either. As you guys have pointed out, the issue is more likely to be with their airbrick than mine but I'll double check tonight when I get back.

Thanks again lads.

 

[Oneofmany]

We state if plume kit fitted then air intake terminal drops to 150mm

Interesting. So their flue is in breach for them but possibly not me. I'll have to measure it. Thanks.

 

[Oneofmany]

Does the flue extend as far as yours does, as yours is closer than 300mm to your window as well; so I have to assume that the length of your black piping takes it far enough away to become legal.

Yes both flues/pipes are the same length and extend out over the balcony but as someone else pointed out they shouldn't drip but do, and onto the general walkway and carpark. They're more than 2.1 M off the ground. Called gas safety but no luck. They don't get involved unless there's an official complaint to the company who did the install, which is fair enough. But I don't know who did it and the housing association and neighbour seem to be tight lipped over anything and everything. The alternative is GS send out a letter to the neighbour requesting entry and inspector BUT expressing that I've complained. I'm not about to go down that route, they're not the friendliest of people.