Bonding on pipe that's been cut

[boolie]

There's a bonding clip on a copper pipe that was connected to a lead supply.

The lead supply pipe is now redundant and the water is supplied by a new MDPE pipe. However the lead pipe is still in place so the copper pipe was cut just before it joined the lead and a stop end was attached

Now the copper pipe has earth bonding on it - but it is no longer connected to the lead pipe. It is ultimately connected to the new MDPE pipe. Does anything need changing?

By the way, there's also bonding on the gas pipe.

 

[EFLImpudence]

Well, strictly speaking, the cable should be connected to the lead pipe or short bit of copper left. How far does it stick up?

The cable need no longer be connected to the copper pipe in the house assuming it does not go into the ground in the house - although it won't be a problem.


You could extend the cable to the gas pipe. Is it in the same location?

 

[boolie]

Well, strictly speaking, the cable should be connected to the lead pipe or short bit of copper left. How far does it stick up?

The cable need no longer be connected to the copper pipe in the house assuming it does not go into the ground in the house - although it won't be a problem.


You could extend the cable to the gas pipe. Is it in the same location?

No, unfortunately the gas pipe is not close. Although, that may change because we are thinking of installing a gas hob in the kitchen.

The lead pipe protrudes about 10 cm and there is some copper attached to it. So I could just reposition the bonding back on to the old pipe

 

[JohnW2]

Well, strictly speaking, the cable should be connected to the lead pipe or short bit of copper left. How far does it stick up?

Indeed, as you say, 'strictly speaking'. I have to say that there are any number of ancient bits of metal pipe entering the walls of my cellar, below ground level, which have been chopped off so as to leave an inch or two protruding into the cellar. Except where they are 'in the way', I haven't bother to 'trim them even further, but ('for my sins'!) I haven't bothered to bond them all, either!

Kind Regards, John

 

[JohnW2]

The lead pipe protrudes about 10 cm and there is some copper attached to it. So I could just reposition the bonding back on to the old pipe

Would it be possible to chop it off more-or-less flush with where it enters your house, and then cover the end it with something insulating (like a 'blank plate' as used for accessory boxes)? The need for bonding ('strictly speaking') only exists if the pipe can be touched.

Kind Regards, John

 

[boolie]

Would it be possible to chop it off more-or-less flush with where it enters your house, and then cover the end it with something insulating (like a 'blank plate' as used for accessory boxes)? The need for bonding ('strictly speaking') only exists if the pipe can be touched.

Kind Regards, John

yes that is possible. TBH I'm not quite sure of the technicalities behind bonding, equi-potential and earthing + I don't know what the differences are + I'm not sure how it it makes things safer. All I know is that it's related to safety. @flameport - have you got a video where you explain all this?

 

[EFLImpudence]

https://www.flameport.com/electrical_theory/earthing_bonding/main_equipotential_bonding.cs4

https://www.flameport.com/electric/index.cs4

 

[flameport]

have you got a video where you explain all this?

Several, https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLVsHvs2SuqmoAjI3AWuW4LGERkbcs4Xcs

For bonding, the basic concept is:
1 - is the part conductive and NOT part of the electrical installation
2 - is the part likely to introduce a potential (which usually means earth potential, such as metal pipes entering from underground)
3 - is the part accessible

If yes to those, then bonding aims to keep the potential (voltage) the same when a fault occurs. Parts connected together will be at or very near the same potential (voltage).

If no to any of those, then bonding probably not required.
Non conductive items don't require bonding, as that would achieve nothing.
Inaccessible parts don't need bonding, as impossible for someone to touch them
Items which don't introduce any potential don't need bonding, which is why metal door handles and metal cutlery in a kitchen drawer are not bonded.

 

[boolie]

OK the house has a bit of a strange situation. So the lead water supply seems to tee off under ground. so the main branch comes into the house, has a stop cock and is bonded. The other route goes straight to an extension and only feeds an outside tap. That has it's own stop cock and is not bonded. The diagram below represents the lead supply

Now, the above diagram contradicts what I originally wrote in the first post. However the above shows the situation before I had a new supply connected. So now I have a new MDPE supply and the old feed into the main house has been cut (the copper that connects to the lead pipe is cut and has a stop end on it). The bonding now sits after the cut (so isn't connected to the lead side any more but is connected to the MDPE side - which is useless!).

Now if I move the bonding to the protruding copper will it make the garden tap section also safe? So technically, is the diagram above safe? btw the water company were supposed to turn off the old supply but havent done so yet. Eventually all this will be a moot point because I will feed the garden tap through the new supply as well and I will cut out any protruding bits from the lead supply. However I want to make it safe in the interim.

 

[JohnW2]

OK the house has a bit of a strange situation. So the lead water supply seems to tee off under ground. so the main branch comes into the house, has a stop cock and is bonded. The other route goes straight to an extension and only feeds an outside tap. That has it's own stop cock and is not bonded. .... So now I have a new MDPE supply and the old feed into the main house has been cut .... Now if I move the bonding to the protruding copper will it make the garden tap section also safe?

How does the garden tap now get its water supply? Exactly where does the new MDPE pipe connect to your house's water system (in relation to your diagram of the previous setup)?

Kind Regards, John

 

[boolie]

How does the garden tap now get its water supply? Exactly where does the new MDPE pipe connect to your house's water system (in relation to your diagram of the previous setup)?

Kind Regards, John

The garden tap is supplied through the old lead supply. The rest of the house is now supplied via the new MDPE.

The garden tap always had a dedicated tee off the lead supply (i.e. tees off before the main stop cock in the house)

So, even under the old lead supply, if I turned off the main stop cock in the house (kitchen) - the garden tap would still run.

 

[JohnW2]

The garden tap is supplied through the old lead supply. The rest of the house is now supplied via the new MDPE. The garden tap always had a dedicated tee off the lead supply (i.e. tees off before the main stop cock in the house) ... So, even under the old lead supply, if I turned off the main stop cock in the house (kitchen) - the garden tap would still run.

Hmmm. Are you saying that they have replaced the metal supply pipe to most of your house with MDPE but have left your garden tap supplied by metal piping? If the supply to your property (as a whole) is now in MDPE, how does that get connected to the metal pipe to the garden tap?

Is your supply metered? If so, where is the meter?

Kind Regards, John

 

[boolie]

Hmmm. Are you saying that they have replaced the metal supply pipe to most of your house with MDPE but have left your garden tap supplied by metal piping? If the supply to your property (as a whole) is now in MDPE, how does that get connected to the metal pipe to the garden tap?

Is your supply metered? If so, where is the meter?

Kind Regards, John

no it's not a 'replacement' per se, it's a brand new supply - with a separate exterior stop cock. So at the moment I have two supplies coming into the house with two separate exterior stop cocks; one that is metered one that is not. The old lead supply and the new MDPE supply. The new MDPE supply comes into the main house and feeds the whole house. The old lead supply into main house has been cut and a stop end applied. The garden tap piping is as it always was - so is supplied by the lead pipe.