cash gift from relative

[moneypenny]

I sort of understand what you are saying.

We lived in different parts of the country. So because I had this cash I told my siblings I would cover all expenses re funeral and we could sort it out later. I had provisionaly booked an undertaker local to him, contacted police for Property ref (neighbour had witnessed cash, cards passport and bank statements removed). so I think everything was covered.

Planned a visit to tie up and contact council. Flat to clear...... it was all very daunting so when coroners office suggested the possibility of handing over to social services because it would take time proving identity etc. it was a relief. After speaking to neighbour I am convinced there is more than enough cash to cover everything needed and I think the coroners office do too because they had property ref.

He had no wife no children just myself and 2 other siblings. I didn't know until 2 days ago he had listed me next of kin at the hospital.

So we are just waiting for results of post mortem and date for funeral. We are not looking for anything from estate just want his affairs tied up and a dignified funeral.

Thanks

 

[JohnD]

If he has recently died, somebody will be paying for a funeral.

This person (sounds like you) may be acting as executor and paying other bills (rent, utilities etc) and may have to pay back any pensions or other benefits paid in advance

It may take them a long time to get access to any bank accounts he may have had. Go through the flat with another trusted family member and collect all bank statements, benefit books, bills and cash, write it down and both keep a copy. Write to all the companies with a standard letter giving his name, address, account no, date of death, and ask for a final statement. You will probably have enough money to settle all the bills but be sure to keep the copies and a note of it all. It will not be much harder than dealing with a month's worth of bills at your own home.

It is actually fairly easy, but slow, to handle an estate and get probate, the Probate Office can send you forms to plough through and are helpful on the phone, they deal with lots of bereaved families every day.

If you pay a solicitor you will still have to find all the papers and account numbers, so you may as well send the letters yourself.

You can get a house clearance company in, but be sure to search for any bundles of cash or family keepsakes beforehand.

It can be used to pay the funeral expenses out of, but BE SURE TO GET A WRITTEN RECEIPT and pay by cheque so you have a record of it

it is very sad how families can fall out after a death when there is a bit of money to be shared out.

 

[TonyW2]

Sorry, but you have misunderstood me.
The gift should not be "returned to the estate" if it was given unconditionally.
So the estate value will not include it.
However on the probate return, you will be asked to list all gifts made within 10 years.
This is done to check IHT due---in this case none---BUT may cause questions to be raised if the gift reduced his capital at the time so as to permit him to claim means tested benefits.
Not all benefits are means tested.
A probate lawyer may not be fully conversant with benefits and hence my suggestion that you check with CAB and give them the full picture.

 

[big-all]

Sorry, but you have misunderstood me.

However on the probate return, you will be asked to list all gifts made within 10 years.

if there is no inheritance tax to pay you do not have to list the gifts ect
form 400 i think it is 2 pages 5 minuit job

http://www.hmrc.gov.uk/inheritancetax/iht400.pdf

 

[JohnD]

if there is no inheritance tax to pay you do not have to list the gifts ect

but surely gifts might have been used to reduce the estate below the free limit, so surely gifts do have to be listed to show if this is the case.

 

[big-all]

yes you state the known amount but not itemised unless they require further clarification that is enough
its done on trust you need to "swear " as an executor to be honest

if the amount is well below inheritance tax levels they wont waste any time as its non productive
if its near itl they may do a quick summary or full audit

 

[TonyW2]

Big all, sorry but you are incorrect.
Page 1 of form 205 , which is used in simple cases where IHT is unlikely to be due, asks specifically about gifts made.
Yes the executor does have to swear that declarations are correct.
(Perjury is not treated lightly and it is surprising how the benefits agencies obtain information from aggrieved relatives etc).
Hence think carefully about the implications of not declaring vs the possible consequences of declaring them.

Unfortunately the OP seems to be a genuine honest person who is agonising about a situation that is not of her making, but was the responsibility of the deceased. Hence my ongoing suggestion that she clarifies her thinking with the aid of the CAB or other understanding and informed source.
If the deceased was not receiving means tested benefits, there is no problem at all. Certainly, anybody who can survive on benefits and manage to pass anything to another person places no obliagation or moral reason on the recipient to return anything into the estate.

 

[big-all]

you do not have to fill in form 205 unless prompted

if you read 400 if you think there is no inheritance tax to pay you are NOT lead to any other form so not applicable unless off course it has changed since dec 2010

we spent all day filling in forms to the best off our abillity as guided by the tax office phone line untill we phoned around the fourth time and where told at last it was one form and a ten miniut job for no inheritance tax

if i am wrong the form has changed
i notice on the bottom of page one on 205 it says



IHS205(2006) www.hmrc.gov.uk/inheritancetax Helpline 08453020900 HMRC 01/11

so may have been updated on 01/2011

 

[moneypenny]

Thank you big-all you are right.

Age Uk have been brilliant and confirmed what the probate solicitor said put my mind at rest as to the possibility benefit could have been paid at the time, very efficient. Confirmed the info given below is 'bunkum'.

CAB hopeless hadn't got a clue, lady told me yes I would have to pay tax regardless of value of the estate but it would be on a sliding scale according to when the gift was given so I may not have to pay it all she spent ages trawling through there data base and came up with that!!!!


Everything is clear

Thanks again and bye for now.

Have some organising to do. x

 

[TonyW2]

Glad you are sorted and sorry your local CAB proved unsatisfactory.
Big-all, 205 is used if no IHT is due and 400 if it is likely or the estate is not eexempt. Both do ask for value of gifts made

 

[big-all]

Glad you are sorted and sorry your local CAB proved unsatisfactory.
Big-all, 205 is used if no IHT is due and 400 if it is likely or the estate is not eexempt. Both do ask for value of gifts made

yes your probably right
i just knew in the end we wasted a whole afternoon for nowt

the problem was they told us to start with the wrong form that kept leading us to other forms unessiserily lol