Compact Flourescent Lamps are bad news

[jabuzzard]

And this seems to be the crux of your entire argument, all the rest about how heat from filaments needs to be made up by the heating system seems just an attempt at justification.

It is not, it is the last of a long list of problems with compact fluorescents.

Points:

1) Typically in the UK the heating is only on for less than half the year. No matter how much of the heat isn't wasted in the winter its still only beneficial *in* the winter. At worst you are only getting half the energy saving pure wattage would indicate. All things considered I can live with that.

I have mine on for about half the year, but then I live in Scotland. I would also point out that when it is not on, I hardly have the lights on anyway. It is nearly 10pm before I put the lights on at the moment...

2) Electricity is inefficient when distributed over long distances, probably more so than the energy costs involved in pumping gas around (or shipping oil) hence it's probably better to use a localised energy converter (aka boiler) than Drax if you have the choice.

For all you know I could be buying carbon neutral electric.

3) Your heating has a specialised job to do. Set it up right with proper control systems and it does it pretty well. Throw large numbers of intermittant heat producing light sources into the equation and you will inevitably mess up its control system leading to overheating and wasted energy at times.

Go do some thermodynamics, because that is just silly nonsense.

You have stated your are "personally very dubious that any energy saving bulbs will reduce overall energy consumption in the UK" how on earth can you justify that claim?

I should have stated that as reducing the carbon emissions of the UK in the cradle to the grave analysis, which is what counts. I readily accept that they have an impact in southern Europe, it is just in northerly latitudes with long cold winter nights, and short summer nights that I firmly believe that proper analysis has not been done, and when done would show a much reduced if any benefit, from that which is being claimed.

We have not talked about the energy of manufacture of the things. which we have conveniently exported to China either. They are one of the most inefficient manufacturing nations in the world, taking more than double the energy to make goods than we do in Europe for example, while releasing a lot more pollutants into the biosphere.

Personally I would have gone for a maximum 100mw standby power consumption, and a minimum 90% effieciency for all power supplies by 2010.