copper or plastic

[Nordio]

However how are you meant to **** about with that tool, in situ

Specialised tools are not designed for copper bashing amatuers to "****" about with!
I think you'll find rehau's manifolds have screwed unions so if you find yerself in a confined space with that particular tool then you probably did something wrong.

They have a range of other tooling available including electric and hydraulic!

 

[Tibbot]

Specialised tools are not designed for copper bashing amatuers to "****" about with!

They're designed for amateurs who've failed at copper bashing. Nothing specialised about a glorified swaging tool.

 

[Norcon]

No , they're designed for installation specialists who want to give their customer the best possible solution.
I had one joint in that particular installation which covered 325sq/m.
It was left accessible under kitchen cabinets as I didn't want to defer from what the customer had initially wanted. (ie. No joints under or buried in the screed)
How would I have acheived that with copper?

 

[Tibbot]

No , they're designed for installation specialists who want to give their customer the best possible solution.

No doubt it is the best possible solution for those who struggle with copper.

 

[Nordio]

No doubt it is the best possible solution for those who struggle with copper.

No its the best solution for a client who wants a professional underfloor heating installation with minimal joints.
What makes you think people who install plastic pipe struggle with copper?

Are you another one of these idiots who would use copper in an underfloor heating installation instead of one the many superior pex/pb/mlcp solutions?

How many underfloor heating systems have you installed? Would the answer be NONE by any chance?

And I'm not talking about some chavs 10 foot square conservatory. Lets say 3000/5000sq/ft newbuild properties.

 

[Tibbot]

If you'd read you'll see I've written on posts that plastic's best for UFH. For general plumbing it's often used by those who struggle with copper or those who don't but prefer to cut corners.

I haven't installed a UFH, though mainly cos' round here it's only on new work which mostly goes to large firms, who mostly employ their least skilled/lowest paid to lay it, who are the same blokes they don't use for copper work.

If I did get such a job I'd use plastic as I have in training but don't flatter yourself that any great talent is involved installing it.

 

[Boilerman2]

Utter rubbish - many boiler manufacturers insist on a metere or two of copper from the boiler BEFORE going plastic

One area wher plastic is great is for replacing heating pipes in screeded floors as they are uneffected by lime corrosion and absorb expansion & contraction and any movement better than copper

 

[Nordio]

but don't flatter yourself that any great talent is involved installing it.

And of course copper requires great talent and skill to work with which is why half the muppets on here like to bang on about using nothing else but copper and plastic is the devils creation because they like to think of them selves as a the most highly talented and skilled plumbers on the planet. Get a life ffs

 

[transam]

Some copper pipe work does require alot of skill plastic probably does not it's easier to work with & is primarily for speed ect ect there is a case for both product's some underfloor heating installs/ manu's do not use plastic
In my opinion to much plastic is finding it's way into this industry boiler manu's useing ever more plastic in there boiler's , Biasi with there virtual all plastic Askora circulating pump's ect ect

 

[Tibbot]

Get a life ffs

Have you had trouble with your soldering by any chance?

 

[enb54]

Hello All...
I see the debate rages on even 'though the basic ideas have been regurgitated many times, and that is that every product has it's place. I have been researching residential boiler systems for the past year and have been amazed at the animosity displayed by people who should know better regarding the different designs and options available to the trade. This stuff is not nuclear physics (I love to play with hot metals) but the consequences to the average homeowner of poor installation and maintenance are similar. If only a homeowner could easily sue a deadbeat HVAC Contractor for financial and mental disaster, perhaps all those in the trade would be better appraised of the consequences of poor training and workmanship... Just my 0.02 Euro's worth...!

 

[Nige F]

Interesting to hear from Canada . I presume your industry over there is properly regulated for both gas /fuels and plumbing - NOT like over here where we have the Prima Donna Gas Safe lot(regulated) and the Plumbers / bathroom fitters/ chancers ( unregulated bleeding free for all ) fighting ad nauseam

 

[benwilliamson]

plastic isn't too bad just ask the people who have piped the country up with it (waterboard) it doesn't look nice on show, but how many people want to see pipes anyway ?

i use both all the time depending on the job, showers in the roof or rad in the hall its a bit like choosing which shoes to wear, going joging or to a wedding ?

 

[Richard C]

plastic isn't too bad just ask the people who have piped the country up with it (waterboard)

Plastic pipe in itself is fine & I assume your talking water mains! I don’t think they rely on a rubber “O” ring & dubious self locking system holding to hold it all together & that's what I have a problem with; or perhaps they do & that’s why we have so many leaks

 

[enb54]

Interesting to hear from Canada . I presume your industry over there is properly regulated for both gas /fuels and plumbing - NOT like over here where we have the Prima Donna Gas Safe lot(regulated) and the Plumbers / bathroom fitters/ chancers ( unregulated bleeding free for all ) fighting ad nauseam

Hi Nige F...
Over here plumbers and gasfitters are in the same trade, just different levels of licensing (industrial vs residential, etc.). I really don't think any one group is better qualified than the other, it is really a matter of training and experience, especially on the high efficiency condensing boilers. Myself and a retired oilfield engineer friend have been playing with some self-fabricated boiler ideas and we have concluded that these things are not serviceable by/for the average person, but anyone with a reasonable understanding of combustion and able to measure gas pressures/combustion products should be able to maintain one. I am actually quite disappointed that the average lifespan of these modern devices ranges from a low of about 5 years to a high of approximately 15 years, personally, that is not acceptable to me. Anyway, will keep on researching (we want to go commercial), and forums like this give us good insight into what's really going on in the domestic (our target) boiler market... Thanks for your response...