Cracks in new render on bathroom wall?

[Richard C]

Aware of your other post in Tiling there is no way I would tank/tile over that; as a effort at rendering, it's crap.

Personally I would reconsider using a cement based tile backer board; you can dot & dab these providing you also fix mechanically which should be within your capabilities & will support much higher tile weights. If you still want the belt & braces of your Tiling post you can tank it as well, using either matting or liquid membrane but, as on your tiling post, is a little OTT for a domestic bath installation IMO.

 

[Albumen]

The saga continues.

The plasterer arrived today to add another 'couple of inches' to that the lower edge of the render is below the level of the bath. I'd told him he'd left it high (despite me marking one wall and the bath being in the room behind him!).

So then we told him we weren't happy and wanted it redoing.

The cracks:

Him 'Ah, that's the suction you see'

Me 'what did you do to control the suction'

Him 'I wetted the wall. I wanted suction otherwise I'd have been here all day'

etc.etc.

The option at the moment is if I take ALL the render off he'll redo it to my satisfaction, for double the money, because it'll take him twice as long.

Which doesn't really make sense. It might need doing over 2 days, but won't take twice as long. He lives a mile away.

There's 4.6 sq ms of wall to render. He's now asking for £300 to do that. After I've taken all the existing off for him.

That sounds like a lot to me. I may as well do it myself.

How much to give him to make him go away? Given that I've already wasted time and will waste more taking it off.

 

[Richard C]

The guy is a complete joke, he doesn’t know what he’s doing, he’s ripping you off with that sort of money & is not interested in any sort of quality. 4.6 sq/m you can do with your eyes closed & one hand tied behind your back; the only irritation is going to be the time spent waiting around for the scratch coat to go off. Don’t pay him anything, tell him he should at least admit to being inexperienced, bu g ger off & practice on someone else’s wall cos that’s what he’s doing. As a parting gesture tell, him he’s bloody lucky you’re not going to charge him to put it right.

 

[Albumen]

Thanks for your support.

I don't think he's a cowboy, certainly the plastering work his ex apprentice did looked fine. And when he says he's been doing it for a long time I believe him. He's part of the local community of builders in this Leeds suburb. I think he's mates with the bloke who's done our electrical work.

But the attitude really hacks me off.

'I've been doing this for 30 years'. Like somebody once said, is that 30 years experience. Or 1 years experience 30 times.

'You're obviously a bit of a DIYer'. This looks like the ultimate insult for pros. Which it isn't. I can do a far better job on my plumbing, for instance, than a plumber, because I can take as much time as I like. Doing everything in soldered copper, with neat tidy bends etc. Whereas all the plunbers who've ever worked here use pushfit plastic and if it's hidden it'll be unsupported and resting on whatever.

And on this job I can do a way better job, cause I can split it over 2 days. He just wanted to get it on as fast as possible and walk away.

But I didn't want a cheap job. We never asked for a cheap job. I didn't argue over his quote. But I stressed over and over that it had to be watertight. I told him how much I paid for the bath, not to show off, but so he knew we aren't cheapskates.

I'm actually a 'bit of a DIYer' because most of the time its the only way I can be sure that the job is done right. I spend so much time chasing people, checking their work and stuff that I figure I may as well do it myself. Then there's only me to blame!!

I don't mind paying people the rate, but I expect a proper job.

His invoice had £40 down for materials. At 4.6 sq ms of average half inch thickness does that sound about right?

If so he earned £110 and according my wife was here for about 3 hours. That's not a fortune. But it's a bit more than I usually work for. And I often work for a lot less than that.

I asked him why he didn't use PVA to prevent suction. He said that the render would have just 'slid down the wall'. Is that true? Just that I'm going to do this myself so I may as well find out how.

 

[joe-90]

Thanks for your support.

I don't think he's a cowboy,

Well we all know that he is. Tell him to clear off and don't pay him anything at all - all he's done is mess your house up.

 

[Albumen]

He's just left a message on my answerphone offering to come round and skim the whole lot with neat cement. Good idea?

 

[troweladdict]

take it off m8te then start agen two coat render then two coat it with muilti finish let i dry then tile
use water proofer in your scrach coat no probs

 

[Albumen]

take it off m8te then start agen two coat render then two coat it with muilti finish let i dry then tile
use water proofer in your scrach coat no probs

Thanks. Why do I need to use multi finish? Can't I tile straight onto the render?

 

[troweladdict]

for one if its plastererd its flatter and easyer too tile if primed its better for tiling and you have more time too play pluss if you not tiling the whole wall its ready too paint

 

[Micilin]

He's just left a message on my answerphone offering to come round and skim the whole lot with neat cement. Good idea?

No, that's a nonsense. It will only tart up the surface, not help adhesion to the wall.

You'll make a job of it yourself, use battens as guides (as per joe's suggestion) if you need a guide.

Scratch coat and float coat of s&c. (4 to 1 and 41/2 or 5 to 1 ). Waterproofer in mix as per product spec. Skim with finish if you are painting, otherwise tile straight onto the render. Tiling bond onto render is stronger than bond of finish to render.

You'll be fine

 

[roughcaster]

Agree with Micilin,,, tile directly onto the render, a far stronger surface.

 

[Albumen]

The 3 (admittedly small) areas that sound hollow when I tap them are all next to large cracks. Makes sense. Rapid shrinkage = cracks, plus loss of adhesion. His argument for difference in noise is the crack itself. But I won't know till I try to take it off.

What's annoying is that he is now saying that if I wanted a top job without cracks he would have had to come back on different days, as he used the suction to get the scratch coat dry enough so he could do it in one day. So if we want it all doing again, without cracks, that's 2 days work and will cost us £300.

Which doens't really stack up. 2 trips out maybe (he lives 1 mile away), but not double the time.

And anyway we didn't say we wanted a cheap job with cracks and hollows. He's the tradesman, he should have said that this will take 2 trips to do a proper job so it'll cost £xxx.

Instead I think he thought I'm just some batty idiot who wants sand and cement on his walls and he got some on there as fast as poss.

 

[Micilin]

His argument for difference in noise is the crack itself.

- Nonsense . Either he doesn't know or knows and hopes you dont' . Either way..........

What's annoying is that he is now saying that if I wanted a top job without cracks he would have had to come back on different days,

"If you wanted a top coat without cracks"? what other top coat would you want - this beggars belief!





And anyway we didn't say we wanted a cheap job with cracks and hollows. He's the tradesman, he should have said that this will take 2 trips to do a proper job so it'll cost £xxx.

Instead I think he thought I'm just some batty idiot who wants sand and cement on his walls and he got some on there as fast as poss.

Exactly right

 

[Richard C]

Thanks. Why do I need to use multi finish?

You don't; there's no point, it will reduce the weight of tiles you can hang & will mean you have to prime before using a cement addy.

Can't I tile straight onto the render?

Yes.

 

[roughcaster]

Proves a point,,,,, no scratch coat!!!! the cause of all the trouble,, useless arsehole.