Crosscut and Rip saw teeth

[Roy66]

So I'm researching hand saws and a lot of websites online claim that there are only two types of teeth found on hand saws: crosscut or rip teeth. I found some pictures online and can see the clear difference between the two and what they do. HOWEVER, when I visited DIY shops and builder's merchants not one of the members of staff had heard of these words!

As well as this, I looked on some tool shops online, and in the product description of the handsaw, it doesn't say whether its crosscut or rip. In fact, it doesn't say anything about the teeth at all.

Could someone please tell me what the different types of teeth are and why no one seems to have heard of the two most common types?

Sorry for the long message,

Cheers,

R

 

[Deleted member 174758]

Try not talking to idiots!

Pretty much all low-cost (i.e. non-sharpenable, disposable, etc) saws sold today are hardpoint, or extra hardened teeth types and they are all cross cut. Rip saws can be had, but they are more specialised with a few firms like Flynns in Sheffield (Pax saws, etc) making them. There are quite a few other teeth forms such as fleam teeth, though

 

[Harbourwoodwork]

I think the days of people in tools shops knowing anything about hand tool's is long gone.
for choice of saw's identify the task's then find the saw for the job
Traditional hand saw's start at around 24"-26" 4 TPI Rip saw for cuttinmg down the grain through loads of length's and styles of teeth japanes triple cut to english double cut and all the different sharpening angles for different jobs right through to 6" gent saw's14TPI
tell us what you want to do.

 

[maltaron]

Try this site if you are researching hand saws. Prior to the cheap hardpoints of today Disston was the professionals choice.

http://www.disstonianinstitute.com

 

[Deleted member 174758]

Try this site if you are researching hand saws. Prior to the cheap hardpoints of today Disston was the professionals choice.

In the UK so was Spear & Jackson. Certainly after the 1930s Disston quality went through the floor

 

[pinenot]

I've read your post and the replies given, but can I ask you why your researching hand saws. If this is purely a wish to bye either rip or crosscut and you simply need a cheap solution, buy a modern throw away hard point, this will cut both.
If on the other hand you attempting some serious research, I believe I can help...pinenot

 

[maltaron]

Jobandknock, Whilst I agree that Disston quality went down slightly after the 30,s with manufacture moving to Canada, it certainly did not go through the floor. I was apprentice in the 50's and all tradesman bought Disston. I still have my Disstons and they are still good. Spear & Jackson were and still are good saws but were slightly softer than Disston and did'n't hold the edge as long, especially on hardwood.

See

//www.diynot.com/forums/tools-materials/saw-sharpening.354028/

for a pic of my Disstons

 

[Harbourwoodwork]

I wouldnt mind a nice traditional panel saw if I could find one, the last one I had was a Disston circa 1978 very numb feeling with a big handle I never really got on with it I think I bought a brand instead of choosing a good saw,infact I had a clearout a bit back and it went

 

[Deleted member 174758]

Whilst I agree that Disston quality went down slightly after the 30,s with manufacture moving to Canada, it certainly did not go through the floor.

From a reputable history of Disston, "(in the 1930s) Dwindling profits and the need to keep paying dividends to the family forced marketing and cost-cutting decisions that would prove detrimental to the long-term health of the company. One area that was neglected for decades was capital investment in the factory. Much of the equipment on the line had been in use since the 1880's. It was old, inefficient, and overworked. By some accounts, nothing was being spent to do more than the most basic maintenance on the factory."

"Disston was sold to H K Porter, a holding company owned by Thomas Mellon Evans, in the early 1950s. Evans wasted no time when it came to liquidating every asset at Disston. Any machines that could be sold for a quick profit were gone. Most members of the Disston family at that time had no interest in saw making, but they didn't want to close down the place, either. H.K. Porter moved the Disston factory to Danville, Virginia, starting in 1956. After Disston left Philadelphia, that was the end of an era."

And from Bob Garay's history comes this: "Quality was never the same (under H.K. Porter) as it was under the Disston family’s control. In 1978 the firm was sold to Sandvick, a Swedish saw company. In 1984 Sandvick sold the company to R.A.F. Industries, as the empire that Henry Disston had built was just an empty shell by then. "

I was apprentice in the 50's and all tradesman bought Disston. Quality was never the same as it was under the Disston family’s control. In 1978 the firm was sold to Sandvick, a Swedish saw company. In 1984 Sandvick sold the company to R.A.F. Industries, as the empire that Henry Disston had built was just an empty shell by then.

When I started in 1969 nobody in my shop would look at a new Disston at that time - they were crude with handles seemingly designed for use by a bear wearing a rigger's glove. I recall that some of the guys had Ibbotson, Turner or Tyzack & Turner saws ("Nonpariel" brand) - sadly all thses brands are now long gone. Disston's were certainly not universal by the time I started - with the site guys tending to use Spear & Jacksons because they were cheaper and being slightly softer steel were supposedly easier/faster to sharpen out on the job. When S&J introduced those modern "designer" handles in the late 1960s everyone went off them as well because the hand holes were just too small for anything other than a ladies hand!