Dedicated 13amp appliance

[Mike2007]

What flex should be put on a 13amp dedicated appliance?

 

[EFLImpudence]

What's a dedicated appliance?

 

[JohnW2]

What flex should be put on a 13amp dedicated appliance?

I'm not sure what you mean by a 'dedicated appliance', but if you're talking about an appliance protected by a 13A fuse (in a plug or fused connection unit), then you need at least 1.25mm² flex, usually 1.5mm². Whether or not it needs to be heat-resistant flex depends upon exactly what the appliance is, and where the flex will be sited.

Kind Regards, John

 

[Taylortwocities]

The size and type of cable stated by the manufacturer.

At a 13amp load, 1.5mm² may be OK if the cable length is relatively short. Longer lengths of cable run, or cables in warm environments may mean a larger csa is needed.

 

[Taylortwocities]

What's a dedicated appliance?

It's one that is very faithful and never leaves you.
My granny had the same Hoover for 40 years, and gran was nutty as a fruitcake. That appliance must have been really dedicated to put up with her.

 

[securespark]

Bet it left in the end, though.

 

[JohnW2]

Bet it left in the end, though.

You may be right, but it's also possible that Granny left first!

Kind Regards, John

 

[Risteard]

The size and type of cable stated by the manufacturer.

At a 13amp load, 1.5mm² may be OK if the cable length is relatively short. Longer lengths of cable run, or cables in warm environments may mean a larger csa is needed.

Or a 0.75mm^2 cable not exceeding 2m in length fitted with a moulded plug?

 

[OwainDIYer]

0r a 0.25 mm² flex on China Export?

 

[ericmark]

Now come on lads the BS7671:2008 is the one which refers to dedicated supply and saying appliance instead of supply is clearly just a slip up.

Table 4F3A states 1.25 mm² for 13A single phase a.c. for flexible cord. As already stated where items like immersion heaters are supplied then you may need heat resistance and larger csa for the cable and for long runs volt drop could also affect the size of cable used.

 

[ericmark]

0r a 0.25 mm² flex on China Export?

Would that be marked CE ?
I know what your thinking but to give wrong sizes may seem funny to you but the reader may not realise it is posted as a funny and could in error think 0.25 mm² flex is OK. Funny it clearly is to those of us that realise but would be better to keep to sensible answer and leave no room for confusion.

 

[EFLImpudence]

Now come on lads the BS7671:2008 is the one which refers to dedicated supply and saying appliance instead of supply is clearly just a slip up.

Fair enough but can you be certain?
In any case John's and TTC's replies answered that. I wanted to make sure.

If you are correct then there is no need for the word 'dedicated' to be included.

Table 4F3A states 1.25 mm² for 13A single phase a.c. for flexible cord.

It could be protected by a BS3036 and require derating.

We don't know what it is.

 

[ericmark]

The size and type of cable stated by the manufacturer.

At a 13amp load, 1.5mm² may be OK if the cable length is relatively short. Longer lengths of cable run, or cables in warm environments may mean a larger csa is needed.

Or a 0.75mm^2 cable not exceeding 2m in length fitted with a moulded plug?

I know you find lead sets with 10A IEC sockets and 13A Plugs with 0.75mm² cable but that does not mean it's allowed. Even 10A requires 1 mm² cable and I think the moulded plug and socket leads with 0.75 mm² cable are designed as computer supplies and not kettle supply. I know the notch is normally found with the kettle (C15 - C16) which will take the higher temperature but the (C13 - C4) IEC lead is still rated 10A as is the (C15 - C16) non of them are rated at 13A so should only be used up to 2.3kW however since a kettle boils in just a few minutes there is not really a problem with such a short time of overload.

To suggest that less than the 1.25mm² listed in the BS7671 regulations as being able to carry 13A without knowing what it's going to feed is folly. Others have pointed out even the 1.25mm² may not be large enough with some applications to say other wise is not really helpful the poster asked a simple question can't see why he/she should not get a simple answer there is no need to confuse.

 

[securespark]

Or a 0.75mm^2 cable not exceeding 2m in length fitted with a moulded plug?

I think Ris is suggesting the manufacturer's specification in order to use 0.75 CSA flex with a 13A fuse.

Towards the end of my career, I saw many (often brand new) appliances with 0.75 flex and moulded plugs, fitted with 13A fuses and, rightly or wrongly, I failed them when PAT testing or called them into question when coming across them on other jobs, simply because 0.75 did not equal 13A according to 7671.

This from an IEE thread:

The legislation - "Plugs and Sockets (Safety) Regulations" refers only to BS1363, NOT the IEE CoP, and the legislation says that, in the absence of manufacturers instructions, the fuse should be rated in accordance with Table 2 of BS1363 (which is now BS1363-1).



BS1363-1 Table 2 rates the fuse by cable size, not appliance rating, but does illustrate MAXIMUM ratings that the flex-fuse combination is suitable for !!!

So, 18W fridge freezer, 0.75 sq mm flex, 13A fuse, is quite safe and acceptable provided the flex length is below the limit in Table 2 of BS1363-1.


I don't know why the IEE CoP doesn't refer on this subject thoroughly enough (e.g. by including Table 2 from BS1363-1, and explaining it properly).

This, I believe, is how Ris arrived at his 2m 0.75 13A appliance lead.

 

[JohnW2]

Towards the end of my career, I saw many (often brand new) appliances with 0.75 flex and moulded plugs, fitted with 13A fuses and, rightly or wrongly, I failed them when PAT testing or called them into question when coming across them on other jobs, simply because 0.75 did not equal 13A according to 7671.

That sounds very reasonable.

This from an IEE thread:
.... So, 18W fridge freezer, 0.75 sq mm flex, 13A fuse, is quite safe and acceptable provided the flex length is below the limit in Table 2 of BS1363-1.

I'm struggling a bit Does anyone have access to "Table 2 of BS1363-1" (and associated text)? [and is an "18W fridge-freezer" a bit optimistic?? - I'm not sure that would cover the lights in mine!]

Kind Regards, John