Does part P go far enough?

[sealeon]

Thats the attitude that will kill you

Sealeon, do you think there's a possibility you could be overreacting just a tad?

sorry

 

[sealeon]

Thats the attitude that will kill you mate

The thing is it almost certainly won't, but what could well happen is that when you say things like that people will write off everything else you say as being the same grossly exaggerated nonsense....

BAS your words mean nothing and quite frankly I couldnt care what YOU think your a big headed idiot

 

[duncanp]

I am a doctor. MB ChB, FRCS, FCEM. Lots of people self treat.

I apologise for saying anyone can do it, you have to have practical and theoretical skills.

Actually there is alot of similarity about understanding how the human body works and plumbing, electricity etc.

Vascular surgeons who I work with are often amazed that I do my own plumbing, sewing grafts onto peoples aortas is alot more tricky than joining pipes with presoldered joints, but they dare'nt have a go.

 

[sealeon]

People do self treat dont disagree but they dont operate on themselves

practical and theorietical is what I am saying you need and if you have it its a good idea to get someone to check your work[/quote]

 

[Pensdown]

The fact you have qualifications and an apprentiship is proof of competence no argument it is

If only that were true.

Most middle aged commercial sparks have never picked up a copy of 7671 since leaving college. They rely on being told what to do and although they may be competent to do that, outside of their day to day comfort zone most are hopelessly out of touch.

 

[FingRinal]

The same can be said of doctors, lawyers, architects, accountants, librarians, politicians...the list could go on.

I guess the difference is that the above wasters have post nominals after their names which justifies their ignorance. Their insistence on using them being directly proportional to the argument that they no longer deserve them. Such post nominals being a source of great mirth in most parts of the world that don't have them.

An argument stands on the merits of the argument borne out by sound reasoning, facts and empirical evidence.

 

[sealeon]

The fact you have qualifications and an apprentiship is proof of competence no argument it is

If only that were true.

Most middle aged commercial sparks have never picked up a copy of 7671 since leaving college. They rely on being told what to do and although they may be competent to do that, outside of their day to day comfort zone most are hopelessly out of touch.

And so comes along the JIB and say if you want to work on site that is anyworth you need you be registered and to register you have to send your valid qualifications 17th edition ECA H and S ASSESMENT a bit like a dom instal scheme really all I know is since the JIB got involved most of the clowns have gone back to working in mc donalds.JIB are a nightmare but it does work.Although I do agree there are alot of people who should be called installers not sparks but then that is down to the firms that employ them

 

[Pensdown]

And so comes along the JIB and say if you want to work on site that is anyworth you need you be registered and to register you have to send your valid qualifications 17th edition ECA H and S ASSESMENT

Not quite. The JIB has been grading sparks since time began. The recent change is they now include very basic site H&S competence under the CSCS scheme. They also vet other trades within the CSCS scheme.

all I know is since the JIB got involved most of the clowns have gone back to working in mc donalds

.
Not in my experience. When I sat the CSCS exam there were plenty who passed.

JIB are a nightmare but it does work.

The JIB still lives in the "closed shop" era and the CSCS scheme is their latest idea to carry on that way. If you read their grading criteria they will not grade someone as an electrician unless they've done a formal apprenticeship. That’s so out of date bearing in mind that nowadays it’s almost impossible to get a formal apprenticeship. Most people go to college on their own back and train themselves. It’s become one of the only ways of getting into the trade. These sparks should be recognised and if they apply they should be graded.

 

[sealeon]

Thats not true they can get graded if they have the qualifications you do not have to be apprenticed trained.The problem is most training providers will only take you to a NVQ 2 and to become graded[gold card]as an electrician you need a level 3.Which is a site diary of a varriety of physical work to prove an all round experience of the work and varrious on site assesment.Most companies specialise in there work domest comm indust or whatever so there is also the problem of finding the varriety needed for the diary.
Any one with an electrical quallification and even those without can be graded wiyh the JIB eg elec opperative apprentis senior graded trainee etc
I totally agree people who have put themselves through training should be reconized

 

[sealeon]

The ECA H and S exam is for site safety it is not really an electrical exam and its not really designed to be failed they send you a book with all the questions and answers in before you sit it.I would think it is more to make you read general site safety issues.
I have definatly seen an improvement on site the quality of work has risen accidents have gone down etc
When you regrade your qualification and experience is checked

 

[Pensdown]

I'll hold my hands up. I've just looked at the JIB grading and at last they've changed their grading criteria.

 

[ban-all-sheds]

BAS your words mean nothing and quite frankly I couldnt care what YOU think your a big headed idiot

My - you really are a towering intellect aren't you, blessed with razor-sharp insight and a faultless ability to intelligently articulate your arguments.

And so comes along the JIB and say if you want to work on site that is anyworth you need you be registered ....JIB are a nightmare but it does work.

NO one with an apprentiship and trade qualifications should have to join a scheme

 

[sealeon]

BAS read your message board.People are entiled to thier own opinions as you are entiled to yours I am entiled to mine I may not be as clever with words as you are but I am happy and glad there are organisations that govern trades.That opnion is made by my own experiences on site.The fact is your argument has already been fought and lost.I am sorry about that but please dont take it out on the trades by implying it is all about me or any other tradesmen trying to make money off the public.
I am not trying to be an intelect or be clever I am expressing an opinion because someones opninion[of the real world not read in books and newspapers?]does not agree with yours it does not make them wrong it just means they have a different opinion.No one could possibly change your point of view as you to strongly believe you are right there fore do not want see the point they are making.
As i have said I dont think DIY is wrong but I do believe that people should be checked for competence if they are working in the industry and a DIYers work proved safe and unless you know of a better way which you have never mentioned in your posts schemes are the only way.
What do YOU think we should do?

 

[sealeon]

BAS from an earlier post you said and I quote

If you want to change something, or introduce something, the onus is on you to justify it, not on someone else to prove it's not justified.unquote

I guess as you have such a problem with it your member of parliment is a good place to start

 

[sealeon]

The JIB provide a way of qualification being registered and checked do you think someones time is worth nothing after all it is thirty five quid and lasts a long time.You are niether in the trade nor have the experience in the trade to comment on it to be quite honest.