Email retrieval

[Bahco]

Just a thought but if say a person was having an affair and is sending out suggestive emails (I'm not BTW) could these emails be accessed after they had been deleted off the computer.

I'm thinking that a private Investigator could retrieve these as evidence that someone has been playing away.

 

[Softus]

It depends on how you delete them.

Deleting a message, or the PST file that contained it, doesn't erase the bits on the disk - they're still available to be forensically retrieved until such time as they're overwritten, which could take a long time.

 

[Mister Dobbo]

The usual pedantic post from softus.
When talking about emails/POP3 "Oh look he referred to an email account accessed with POP3 as an account instead of protocol" I'll bang on and on about that untill I'm blue in the face

Tony stated that that "the messages are deleted from the e-mail server by default after they are downloaded to your computer. "

To which softus amazing reply was "Messages are stored in a mailbox indefinitely, subject to its size quota, as long as the account is kept active (and as long as the mail host doesn't crash).

If you use an Email client, such as Outlook Express, then you may configure it to retrieve using POP3 and then to delete after retrieval. Or not delete. Whichever you prefer. "

So what was wrong in Tony's post apart from he gave the information on what happens by default, which the vast majority of home users of Outlook or OE stick with?

So emails Messages are NOT stored in a mailbox indefinitely, subject to its size quota, as long as the account is kept active (and as long as the mail host doesn't crash). They can also be deleted which is what happens by DEFAULT with the email clients being spoken about.

Softus wrote "If you use an Email client, such as Outlook Express, then you may configure it to retrieve using POP3 and then to delete after retrieval. Or not delete. Whichever you prefer. " Should read "If you use an Email client, such as Outlook Express, then you may configure it to retrieve using POP3 and then NOT to delete after retrieval. If you prefer.

The usual twisting things around by softus to try to make an argument out of nothing.

 

[Softus]

The usual twisting things around...

Quite the contrary. I stated facts - Tony has chosen to try and argue against them.

My first post was clearly aimed at more people than just Tony, and you don't want me to "bang on", then stop posting untruths.

 

[Mister Dobbo]

The usual twisting things around...

Quite the contrary. I stated facts - Tony has chosen to try and argue against them.


My first post was clearly aimed at more people than just Tony, and you don't want me to "bang on", then stop posting untruths.

Where are the facts about deleting Emails in here then

Messages are stored in a mailbox indefinitely, subject to its size quota, as long as the account is kept active (and as long as the mail host doesn't crash).

For that statement to be fact it would state about deleting Emails which is the norm in the clients being used.

Did I say your 1st post wasn't aimed at more people than Tony? I only quoted Tony because you did and then dissected his post.

Maybe you could show me my "untruths"

 

[TonyWarrington]

Messages are stored in a mailbox indefinitely, subject to its size quota, as long as the account is kept active (and as long as the mail host doesn't crash).

Quote MS "E-mail account types differ in how e-mail messages are saved and synchronized with the e-mail server."
I don't know why you've written that, given that it doesn't conflict with anything I've written.

Why have you chosen to ignore the second sentence -"For example, by default POP3 e-mail accounts delete e-mail messages from the e-mail server when downloaded into Outlook"? We are talking about the way Outlook behaves here.

FYI, Microsoft didn't invent Email, or computers, or software, or the Internet, so I don't know why you hold it (MS) in such high regard.

I don't know why you think I hold MS in such high regard. I do however believe that they should know how their own email software operates hence me quoting them

Quote MS "For example, by default POP3 e-mail accounts delete e-mail messages from the e-mail server when downloaded into Outlook."
Firstly, "accounts" don't delete messages.

Quite right - perhaps you should point out this error to MS as the quote was taken from their documentation.

Secondly, whilst the above is true of Outlook, deletion is not the default POP3 protocol behaviour.

I don't know why you've written that, given that it doesn't conflict with anything I've written about Outlook which after all is the subject of this topic.

If you use an Email client, such as Outlook Express, then you may configure it to retrieve using POP3 and then to delete after retrieval. Or not delete. Whichever you prefer.

OP stated he uses Outlook not OE.
...a fact that didn't prevent you and others writing, and you continuing to write, nonsense.

The nonsense here is in your pedantic ramblings

 

[Softus]

Where are the facts about deleting Emails in here then

Messages are stored in a mailbox indefinitely, subject to its size quota, as long as the account is kept active (and as long as the mail host doesn't crash).

They're not in there, they're in the paragraph immediately after that - the one you haven't quoted.

For that statement to be fact it would state about deleting Emails which is the norm in the clients being used.

Taking a statement out of context isn't an effective way of arguing against a die-hard pedant. Try again.

Did I say your 1st post wasn't aimed at more people than Tony?

I don't know. Can't you remember?

I only quoted Tony because you did and then dissected his post.

Well, I trust you got something out of that little exercise.

Maybe you could show me my "untruths"

Yup - here's one:-

The usual twisting things around...

___________________

Why have you chosen to ignore the second sentence?

I haven't ignored anything.

If I quote something, you object. If I don't, you object. You need to get your act together.

We are talking about the way Outlook behaves here.

I know that you're attempting to, and I know that limiting your context to one client ought to increase your chances of being correct, but in that respect you've managed to snatch defeat from the jaws of victory.

FYI, Microsoft didn't invent Email, or computers, or software, or the Internet, so I don't know why you hold it (MS) in such high regard.

I don't know why you think I hold MS in such high regard.

Well I can tell you - it's because you quoted a statement that you say MS has published, and you did it in a manner that suggests you believe that statement to be correct.

I do however believe that they should know how their own email software operates hence me quoting them

Ergo, you hold it (MS) in high regard, relative, for example, to the regard in which I hold it (MS).

Quote MS "For example, by default POP3 e-mail accounts delete e-mail messages from the e-mail server when downloaded into Outlook."
Firstly, "accounts" don't delete messages.

Quite right - perhaps you should point out this error to MS as the quote was taken from their documentation.

Thank you, but I already know that it's quite right - that's why I posted it.

Perhaps you should point it out, since you spend more time than I do reading, and quoting, and believing, its (MS's) abysmal documentation.

Secondly, whilst the above is true of Outlook, deletion is not the default POP3 protocol behaviour.

I don't know why you've written that, given that it doesn't conflict with anything I've written about Outlook which after all is the subject of this topic.

Outlook is part of the subject, but it covered other clients and (by implication) protocols, before Outlook was named by the OP as his Email client.

 

[TonyWarrington]

Why have you chosen to ignore the second sentence?

I haven't ignored anything.

If I quote something, you object. If I don't, you object. You need to get your act together.

On the contrary it is you who needs to get your act together. The second sentence stated that by default POP3 accounts delete emails by default in Outlook. I believe that you ignored this as it did not sit well with your argumentative needs.

We are talking about the way Outlook behaves here.

I know that you're attempting to, and I know that limiting your context to one client ought to increase your chances of being correct, but in that respect you've managed to snatch defeat from the jaws of victory.

I did limit the context to one client, Outlook (and possibly the same applies to OE), but not to increase my chances of being correct as you put it. I already know that my answer for Outlook is correct.
Not clear where you are coming from "snatch defeat from the jaws of victory"

FYI, Microsoft didn't invent Email, or computers, or software, or the Internet, so I don't know why you hold it (MS) in such high regard.

I don't know why you think I hold MS in such high regard.

Well I can tell you - it's because you quoted a statement that you say MS has published, and you did it in a manner that suggests you believe that statement to be correct.

Ah, thank you for clarifying that - the statement from MS is Contained within this document which I do believe to be correct.

Quote MS "For example, by default POP3 e-mail accounts delete e-mail messages from the e-mail server when downloaded into Outlook."
Firstly, "accounts" don't delete messages.

Quite right - perhaps you should point out this error to MS as the quote was taken from their documentation.
Thank you, but I already know that it's quite right - that's why I posted it.

Perhaps you should point it out, since you spend more time than I do reading, and quoting, and believing, its (MS's) abysmal documentation.

Why should I want to point out an error that you spotted to MS, you are the one that seems to have issues with this and MS "abysmal documentation". I am sure that they would offer you a lucrative position correcting their errors

Secondly, whilst the above is true of Outlook, deletion is not the default POP3 protocol behaviour.
I don't know why you've written that, given that it doesn't conflict with anything I've written about Outlook which after all is the subject of this topic.

Outlook is part of the subject, but it covered other clients and (by implication) protocols, before Outlook was named by the OP as his Email client.

Before Outlook was named by the OP the only other named email client was Outlook Express- correct me if I am wrong but I believe that the default settings for this also delete downloaded emails

 

[Estrella]

correct me if I am wrong but I believe that the default settings for this also delete downloaded emails

It depends on the email account. A lot of the freebie email providers retain copies regardless. Hotmail for example. But you are correct, by default OE will not leave a copy on your hosts server.

I have my email set so that as well as emails coming to my domain name email account, it also send a copy to a GoogleMail account so that I have a duplicate.

I would trawl through Softus' posts, but unfortunately life is just too short.

 

[Softus]

On the contrary it is you who needs to get your act together.

Well, I foresee that we're not going to agree on that point.

Ah, thank you for clarifying that - the statement from MS is Contained within this document which I do believe to be correct.

As implied earlier, I don't have the time or inclination to read arbitrary MS documents. I know how Email works, and until the next time I encounter an MS Exchange fault I won't be wasting my life on any of those documents.

Why should I want to point out an error that you spotted to MS, you are the one that seems to have issues with this and MS "abysmal documentation".

No issues at all. The glaring error that you quoted (and failed to spot) has no impact on anything I need to do.

I am sure that they would offer you a lucrative position correcting their errors

Thank you, but I already have a lucrative position, and I'm not a greedy person.

Before Outlook was named by the OP the only other named email client was Outlook Express- correct me if I am wrong but I believe that the default settings for this also delete downloaded emails

The default installation does indeed do that, until such time as someone changes the setting from its default, but there's no such thing as default POP3 behaviour, since it's a protocol - an important subtlety that seems to repeatedly escape your understanding.

Fudging the issue may work well enough for you and the people whom you advise, but whatever thing or person gives you the right to think that I'm pedantic gives me the equal right to use that pedantry to point out your errors. If you don't like them being pointed out, then don't post them.

 

[TonyWarrington]

Well, I foresee that we're not going to agree on that point.

Agreed

Before Outlook was named by the OP the only other named email client was Outlook Express- correct me if I am wrong but I believe that the default settings for this also delete downloaded emails
.... but there's no such thing as default POP3 behaviour, since it's a protocol - an important subtlety that seems to repeatedly escape your understanding.

I have not disputed the fact that POP3 is a protocol

Fudging the issue may work well enough for you and the people whom you advise, but whatever thing or person gives you the right to think that I'm pedantic gives me the equal right to use that pedantry to point out your errors. If you don't like them being pointed out, then don't post them.

No fudging of issues here and I have no problem in being corrected where I am wrong. What I do object to is the manner in which you try to correct posters

 

[Estrella]

In case you haven't got the energy Tony, I have condensed Softus' post below.

Blah, blah, blah, irrelevant blah. The end

 

[Softus]

What I do object to is the manner in which you try to correct posters

Objection noted.

If you get a grip and stop posting nonsense then it'll cease to be a problem.

The end

We shall see.

 

[TonyWarrington]

In case you haven't got the energy Tony, I have condensed Softus' post below.

Blah, blah, blah, irrelevant blah. The end

Well put BoxCleva, wish I had thought to reply that way and save some enegy

 

[Mister Dobbo]

In case you haven't got the energy Tony, I have condensed Softus' post below.

Blah, blah, blah, irrelevant blah. The end

The exact reason I CBA to comment on softus last bunch of comments with such gems as "I don't know. Can't you remember?" it's like talking to my 6 year old nephew.

What I do object to is the manner in which you try to correct posters

Objection noted.

If you get a grip and stop posting nonsense then it'll cease to be a problem.

Just about sums the bloke up really, no idea how to communicate with other people in a reasonable manner.

Softus seemed to completly miss the point of why I posted so I'll spell it out even more simply.
Tony posted a reply helping someone with a problem, it was easy to understand, this is what most people do on this forum. But then softus comes trolling along looking the next subject he can pick up on in some way. It would be like going on to the building forum pages and finding a post like "just bolt the bracket on the wall at 1500mm up." softus would be "you dont bolt it you screw it. you rawplug it the you screw it to the wall...." Blah, blah, blah, irrelevant blah. The end.

Then on any reply he would attempt to patronise and put up some façade that he is such an expert and the poster was talking such nonsense and how any one could understand them was beyond him. Meanwhile the OP has gone off and bolted the bracket to the wall, even if it was with a screw!

All forums seem to have their softus's they try to talk down other genuine posters and deter new users from posting for the fear of being picked up by the forum nazis.

I look forward to softus next amazingly witty and insightful posting. Yawn.